8 year 6 month for murder

Eligible for release around their 21st birthdays… something their victim didn’t get to see.


I couldn’t care less if they are 13 or 113… they are not human, they are murderers

It’s a fcuking disgrace
 
Eligible for release around their 21st birthdays… something their victim didn’t get to see.


I couldn’t care less if they are 13 or 113… they are not human, they are murderers

It’s a fcuking disgrace
What if they were 3? Age matters and 13 year olds, despite knowing right from wrong are not equipped to understand the implications of their actions in the same way a fully mature adult is. That’s why they almost always get shorter sentences.
 
What if they were 3? Age matters and 13 year olds, despite knowing right from wrong are not equipped to understand the implications of their actions in the same way a fully mature adult is. That’s why they almost always get shorter sentences.


Don’t be F***ing ridiculous have you actually seen what they did to that lad? It wasn’t a case of a fight getting out of hand and him getting stabbed once.

They hacked him to death with multiple blows to the point that huge clumps of his flesh were hanging from his body.

The nearly decapitated him.

The blade repeatedly went through his body and out the other side.

They knew exactly what they were doing… age doesn’t make you a murderer… being completely fcuked in the head makes you a murderer and as such they need to be locked up for public safety.
 
Don’t be F***ing ridiculous have you actually seen what they did to that lad? It wasn’t a case of a fight getting out of hand and him getting stabbed once.

They hacked him to death with multiple blows to the point that huge clumps of his flesh were hanging from his body.

The nearly decapitated him.

The blade repeatedly went through his body and out the other side.

They knew exactly what they were doing… age doesn’t make you a murderer… being completely fcuked in the head makes you a murderer and as such they need to be locked up for public safety.
I’m not being ridiculous. You said there should be no difference between 13 or 113 when it comes to sentencing so I took it to extremes to emphasise why there is a difference. You don’t wake up one day as a fully mature adult. It’s a gradual process. It therefore makes sense that if you wouldn’t jail a toddler for a crime you would give an adult 20 years for, there should be a sliding scale for all ages in between.

You can argue all day long about whether the sentences for murder are long enough or not and I agree with you that they should be longer but there are good reasons children aren’t treated as adults in the vast majority of cases.
 
But if they could stay detained for longer why is the minimum term so ridiculously short for murder. Doesnt make sense to me when compared to the oil protesters and some of the rioters??
 
But if they could stay detained for longer why is the minimum term so ridiculously short for murder. Doesnt make sense to me when compared to the oil protesters and some of the rioters??
The kids will only get out when the kids are safe and rehabilitated. Before even a release is an option that is after 8.5 years. This is unlikely to happen.

The judge will have looked at the sentencing guidelines and read pre sentence reports.
 
Here's an article to that might be useful in this discussion. I've linked the whole thing, but I see the relevant section as:

"Adolescents are prone towards increased risk-taking and this is associated with the development of a number of brain-structures Two brain systems are especially important: the prefrontal cortex (PFC), which is the control system; and the ventral striatum, the reward system. The control system is involved in impulse control, the ability to stop a certain urge or action, and thus involved in self-regulation. The ability for self-regulation develops strongly from the age of 12 until the age of 18 [45], but continues to improve into early adulthood [7]."




Society doesn't afford children the same rights as adults to make decisions regarding voting, drinking, medical consent etc. because it doesn't credit them with the same capacity for decision-making as adults. If that principle is established, inconvenient though it may be, it has to apply to sentencing too.

Fully take the point about protecting the public, and they are indeed being locked up. I don't have a problem reviewing the situation in 8 years.

But if a child can't take full responsibility, that suggests someone else is partly responsible. In this type of case, can guardians be prosecuted on the back of their children doing something like this? What about the suppliers of the weapons?
 
I’m not being ridiculous. You said there should be no difference between 13 or 113 when it comes to sentencing so I took it to extremes to emphasise why there is a difference. You don’t wake up one day as a fully mature adult. It’s a gradual process. It therefore makes sense that if you wouldn’t jail a toddler for a crime you would give an adult 20 years for, there should be a sliding scale for all ages in between.



You can argue all day long about whether the sentences for murder are long enough or not and I agree with you that they should be longer but there are good reasons children aren’t treated as adults in the vast majority of cases.


Show me at any time in history where a 3 year old has murdered someone…. You can’t as they are not physically able to do it.

These two 13 year old wastes of skin have. They have been tried for the crime of murder and convicted of the crime of murder…. And not just any murder but that on one so heinous that the victim was hacked to death.

The punishment doesn’t fit the crime. These fcukers are not fit to breathe the same air as you and me. And once they are released we will no doubt see them do something similar again.
 
Seems extremely lenient, they will be only slightly older than the victim whose life they ended when they are released from prison. Plus they will receive absolutely zero rehabilitation due to the sorry state of the prison system
They won't enter the prison system until they're 18 at least. They'll be detained in a secure centre with considerable resources devoted to their rehabilitation.
 
It's not about whether I agree with it or not, you asked why they were given such a short minimum term, I advised you listen to the summing up, you can then decide whether you agree or not.
Ok do you agree with the summing up in your opinion should the minimum sentence be longer
 
Here's an article to that might be useful in this discussion. I've linked the whole thing, but I see the relevant section as:

"Adolescents are prone towards increased risk-taking and this is associated with the development of a number of brain-structures Two brain systems are especially important: the prefrontal cortex (PFC), which is the control system; and the ventral striatum, the reward system. The control system is involved in impulse control, the ability to stop a certain urge or action, and thus involved in self-regulation. The ability for self-regulation develops strongly from the age of 12 until the age of 18 [45], but continues to improve into early adulthood [7]."




Society doesn't afford children the same rights as adults to make decisions regarding voting, drinking, medical consent etc. because it doesn't credit them with the same capacity for decision-making as adults. If that principle is established, inconvenient though it may be, it has to apply to sentencing too.

Fully take the point about protecting the public, and they are indeed being locked up. I don't have a problem reviewing the situation in 8 years.

But if a child can't take full responsibility, that suggests someone else is partly responsible. In this type of case, can guardians be prosecuted on the back of their children doing something like this? What about the suppliers of the weapons?
Fascinating paper
 
Human life is worth beggar all nowadays to our state and legal system. It only matters if it is one of their own to the state. Ordinary Joes like us are valueless, one less pension to worry about in time, one less mouth to feed when were older. Money ahd goods are higher value than an ordinary life to state actors. They want our votes and money, but nowt else. I have so lost faith in our government process and all the self interest and corruption in plain sight.
what an absolute load of paranoid twaddle

sorry dont normally post critical things but that post shocked me
 
As a foster carer I have seen a good few children that some on here would consider ‘wrong uns’ and would bang up for life if they killed someone.

They are children. Their minds are not formed like an adults. We shouldn’t be locking children up for life.

And for those who are wondering who else imprisons children for life amongst our neighbours have a read of this:


Quite a lot set the age of criminal responsibility at 14 too - so these countries don’t see 13 as an age where you should be prosecuted for murder.
 
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