Dairy and meat exports down 96% due to Brexit

Randy said:
I work in the industry, I'm in constant contact with my employers and others around the country and Europe in the industry who I've worked with, for and trained with. The plans are there and they will succeed.
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As I have said a few times now, this level of delusion can't be argued against. It's futile. Pre-Brexit it was the promise of unicorns. Post-Brexit it is always going to be the case that those unicorns are arriving momentarily.
 
That last paragraph is the key thing for me. I hate discussions collapsing into personal arguements. However I'm not the type to back down when the personal insults fly which is why when I get personally insulted the thread always gets derailed.

We should listen to @Andy_W . Try arguing the points instead of attacking the man. We'd still have arguments but they would go somewhere instead if just degenerating into abuse. Just try it people, try acting like grown ups. We might not agree but we'll get something more productive, more easy to read.
 
Adi_Dem said:
As I have said a few times now, this level of delusion can't be argued against. It's futile. Pre-Brexit it was the promise of unicorns. Post-Brexit it is always going to be the case that those unicorns are arriving momentarily.
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I'd like to know more about the plans though. What exactly does the hospitality industry have planned for when food and products cost more and people have less money to spend on luxuries? Maybe @Randy can enlighten us?
 
SmallTown said:
I'd like to know more about the plans though. What exactly does the hospitality industry have planned for when food and products cost more and people have less money to spend on luxuries? Maybe @Randy can enlighten us?
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I can save you some time if you wish.......
 
Randy said:
Again not defending brexit. I'm still awaiting a quotation where I did. Circles.

I work in the industry, I'm in constant contact with my employers and others around the country and Europe in the industry who I've worked with, for and trained with. The plans are there and they will succeed. Some businesses will fall along the way, that's happened before brexit has had an impact and it'll continue after brexit till the end of time.
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Ok, so what is your position? Which way did you vote, if you did?

You don't seem to be against Brexit, or think it's going to have much of an impact, and you are seemingly against those that logically point out that Brexit is a problem, and will likely end up in a much bigger one.

I am your client, and in constant contact with your clients, everyone is, as everyone is the economy and the economy is effectively hospitality's client. Even the best laid plans are largely irrelevant If you lose clients or the economy suffers, as if a situation arises resulting in an economic hit the industry suffers, it's just a fact. I hope it doesn't end up that way though, I really do, as I love the industry.

Randy said:
Businesses thrive or fail every week.
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They will, but there will be less thriving and more failing if the economy suffers, and the EU was a massive part of that which we seemingly can't replace easily, locally or anytime soon. There may even be marginal growth, but this would still be a loss compared to where we would likely have been, and that's the benchmark.

Randy said:
Brexit might be ****, it might be good, nobody can know for absolute certain after 4 months.
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It might be good, it might be bad, and yes, nobody can know for certain, nobody is saying they do know for certain. But on the balance of probability, it's highly likely to be worse, and the pain will hit some areas more than others (like the North East).

Randy said:
People will be itching to get out and about after this pandemic is over. It's then up to hospitality businesses around the country to work hard to keep them coming back.
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Definitely, I certainly am! The industry should get a massive boost over the next few months, and it certainly needs it. But you're right the industry does need to work to keep them coming back, and also needs to still be cautious, as after the short term boost there's going to be a large period of massive uncertainty.

Good luck with it though, as if your industry ends up doing ok, it generally means the rest would be ticking over nicely.
 
Adi_Dem said:
I can save you some time if you wish.......
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It'd be interesting to hear. Randy makes a very confident statement there about the future of his industry.

I do hope there's something to back this up. And he's not just lying to look better in the short term
 
SmallTown said:
It'd be interesting to hear. Randy makes a very confident statement there about the future of his industry.

I do hope there's something to back this up. And he's not just lying to look better in the short term
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Nothing wrong with been confident ST. 😀
 
Andy_W said:
Ok, so what is your position? Which way did you vote, if you did?

You don't seem to be against Brexit, or think it's going to have much of an impact, and you are seemingly against those that logically point out that Brexit is a problem, and will likely end up in a much bigger one.

I am your client, and in constant contact with your clients, everyone is, as everyone is the economy and the economy is effectively hospitality's client. Even the best laid plans are largely irrelevant If you lose clients or the economy suffers, as if a situation arises resulting in an economic hit the industry suffers, it's just a fact. I hope it doesn't end up that way though, I really do, as I love the industry.


They will, but there will be less thriving and more failing if the economy suffers, and the EU was a massive part of that which we seemingly can't replace easily, locally or anytime soon. There may even be marginal growth, but this would still be a loss compared to where we would likely have been, and that's the benchmark.



It might be good, it might be bad, and yes, nobody can know for certain, nobody is saying they do know for certain. But on the balance of probability, it's highly likely to be worse, and the pain will hit some areas more than others (like the North East).



Definitely, I certainly am! The industry should get a massive boost over the next few months, and it certainly needs it. But you're right the industry does need to work to keep them coming back, and also needs to still be cautious, as after the short term boost there's going to be a large period of massive uncertainty.

Good luck with it though, as if your industry ends up doing ok, it generally means the rest would be ticking over nicely.
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Nobody is saying they know for certain?

Come on Andy, every brexit thread has the same group of people predicting the apocalypse.

I do disagree with what you said earlier though about 'non essential' jobs. Every job is essential wether you are a waiter, a bin man, a nuclear scientist, a police officer or a warehouse operative. A waiter's job might not be essential to you but it is to the waiter. In my opinion those deeming certain jobs 'non essential' are showing a bit of snobbery.
 
Randy said:
Nobody is saying they know for certain?

Come on Andy, every brexit thread has the same group of people predicting the apocalypse.

I do disagree with what you said earlier though about 'non essential' jobs. Every job is essential wether you are a waiter, a bin man, a nuclear scientist, a police officer or a warehouse operative. A waiter's job might not be essential to you but it is to the waiter. In my opinion those deeming certain jobs 'non essential' are showing a bit of snobbery.
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All jobs are essential but not all businesses are.
 
Adi_Dem said:
Well, since you're keen on accuracy of statement can you point to where any poster has predicted the apocalypse?
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That one is easily explained. Randy has never appeared to be able to understand nuances or subtlety. Maybe it's the simple way he sees the world but things are black or white for him. If you say something will probably be worse than it is now, he'll take that to mean the end of the world. In reality it "just" means a lower standard of living, lower quality and less choice of produce and increased unemployment. For some people it's easier to simplify than think.

Besides stop asking him more questions. He's already failed to answer my pretty simple one!
 
SmallTown said:
That one is easily explained. Randy has never appeared to be able to understand nuances or subtlety. Maybe it's the simple way he sees the world but things are black or white for him. If you say something will probably be worse than it is now, he'll take that to mean the end of the world. In reality it "just" means a lower standard of living, lower quality and less choice of produce and increased unemployment. For some people it's easier to simplify than think.

Besides stop asking him more questions. He's already failed to answer my pretty simple one!
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Sick to F***ing death of you assassinating my character ST with your sly digs. 😵
You want me to share business plans with a complete stranger on the internet? Yeah right'o.
You just can't accept the fact that somebody else knows more about something he/she is involved with more than you think you know
 
In fact you know what?

You all win.

Does that make you all feel better about your Thursday?

You've all moaned about brexit yet not one of you has declared an intention or come up with any ideas to try and change anything or do anything about it.
 
Randy said:
In fact you know what?

You all win.

Does that make you all feel better about your Thursday?

You've all moaned about brexit yet not one of you has declared an intention or come up with any ideas to try and change anything or do anything about it.
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Come on Randy, there's been plenty on here saying we should rejoin.

I was very mixed over the EU but I just couldn't understand most of the arguments put forward, they didn't make sense.

We're still being lied to over sovereignty, it's quite clear from other nations' actions that we already had enough autonomy to make decisions that we blamed the EU for.

Our major problem lies at home, we're claiming to be a democratic nation whilst moving away from democracy for four decades.

We need decentralising with local income tax and business tax to replace the centrally governed rating system, it worked in the past, the current system is failing

We need open borders to allow labour to travel and not be shackled in and an education system that gives us enough background knowledge to not be swayed by a continual lying media.

All we have is fear and the promotion of it in order to keep us pegged down.
 
Corcaigh_the_Cat said:
Come on Randy, there's been plenty on here saying we should rejoin.

I was very mixed over the EU but I just couldn't understand most of the arguments put forward, they didn't make sense.

We're still being lied to over sovereignty, it's quite clear from other nations' actions that we already had enough autonomy to make decisions that we blamed the EU for.

Our major problem lies at home, we're claiming to be a democratic nation whilst moving away from democracy for four decades.

We need decentralising with local income tax and business tax to replace the centrally governed rating system, it worked in the past, the current system is failing

We need open borders to allow labour to travel and not be shackled in and an education system that gives us enough background knowledge to not be swayed by a continual lying media.

All we have is fear and the promotion of it in order to keep us pegged down.
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They have yes.

Any plan to do it though?

Like I said I'm out, I didn't join this forum to be called stupid by total strangers and have my character called into question. Best to just avoid any threads with the word b****t in.
 
Randy said:
Sick to F***ing death of you assassinating my character ST with your sly digs. 😵
You want me to share business plans with a complete stranger on the internet? Yeah right'o.
You just can't accept the fact that somebody else knows more about something he/she is involved with more than you think you know
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I can totally accept the fact that people know more than me about an industry I know nothing about. Just pointing out the hypocrisy of the situation: When we talk about the economic downturn that likely due to brexit people like you say "you can't predict the future, this hasn't happened". So, trying to counter that by claiming you have "plans" but are unable to prove them seems at best hypocritical. At worst it can appear dishonest. When people make bold statements and then get angry and clam up when people question those statements. It makes me wonder if you are actually lying.
 
Andy_W said:
Ok, so what is your position? Which way did you vote, if you did?

You don't seem to be against Brexit, or think it's going to have much of an impact, and you are seemingly against those that logically point out that Brexit is a problem, and will likely end up in a much bigger one.

I am your client, and in constant contact with your clients, everyone is, as everyone is the economy and the economy is effectively hospitality's client. Even the best laid plans are largely irrelevant If you lose clients or the economy suffers, as if a situation arises resulting in an economic hit the industry suffers, it's just a fact. I hope it doesn't end up that way though, I really do, as I love the industry.


They will, but there will be less thriving and more failing if the economy suffers, and the EU was a massive part of that which we seemingly can't replace easily, locally or anytime soon. There may even be marginal growth, but this would still be a loss compared to where we would likely have been, and that's the benchmark.



It might be good, it might be bad, and yes, nobody can know for certain, nobody is saying they do know for certain. But on the balance of probability, it's highly likely to be worse, and the pain will hit some areas more than others (like the North East).



Definitely, I certainly am! The industry should get a massive boost over the next few months, and it certainly needs it. But you're right the industry does need to work to keep them coming back, and also needs to still be cautious, as after the short term boost there's going to be a large period of massive uncertainty.

Good luck with it though, as if your industry ends up doing ok, it generally means the rest would be ticking over nicely.
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Andy, I think you need to re-read the thread.

If ST wants people to play the ball and not the man he should keep a civil tongue in his head. Something he is clearly unable to do.

When you call people liars, dishonest, stupid, hard of thinking you are going to get people making personal comments back at you. He can stop doing all those things and he wouldn't get the abuse he gets. It's a goes a round, comes around sort of thing.

Over and above all that, on this thread, Randy didn't vote tory, nor did he vote for brexit. He simply pointed out that as a restaurant his business orders were way down for produce, as would be the entire EU block so some of the shortfall in produce exports would be down to that. A perfectly reasonable argument.

On the other hand you have ST who voted tory, voted in an election with a single manifesto pledge, to get brexit done.

Hmm... I wonder why people get annoyed with him.
 
Laughing said:
Andy, I think you need to re-read the thread.

If ST wants people to play the ball and not the man he should keep a civil tongue in his head. Something he is clearly unable to do.

When you call people liars, dishonest, stupid, hard of thinking you are going to get people making personal comments back at you. He can stop doing all those things and he wouldn't get the abuse he gets. It's a goes a round, comes around sort of thing.

Over and above all that, on this thread, Randy didn't vote tory, nor did he vote for brexit. He simply pointed out that as a restaurant his business orders were way down for produce, as would be the entire EU block so some of the shortfall in produce exports would be down to that. A perfectly reasonable argument.

On the other hand you have ST who voted tory, voted in an election with a single manifesto pledge, to get brexit done.

Hmm... I wonder why people get annoyed with him.
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Oh dear. You should have read my last post. I don't care if people get annoyed with me. I have forthright views and really have no qualms about upsetting people on the internet. I do have an issue with the quality of debate though. When people get personal, I attack back because I'm not the type to sit there and take it. The problem is when people ONLY get personal. We saw on the other thread at least 3 people read to jump on me, and utterly ignore the issues being discussed. That's the problem. You yourself seem more interested in having a go at peoples personalities then ever debating the issues. Try having a grown up conversation for a change.

For the record, I DO think brexit is a stupid idea and I'm suspicious of anyone who, at this point in time, will try and defend it or deflect from us discussing the issues. If you don't like this, prove me wrong. I feel like I've been saying this for 4 years now but it's just the way. I consider brexit to be a destructive force. The vote to leave was based on ignorance, fear, bigotry and misplaced national pride. Now the problems with it are being laid bare for all to see I will absolutely treat anyone who tries to still defend it with the contempt I think they deserve. You have two options when this happens: take up the debate and prove me wrong, or react to my strong views with personal insults that completely ignore what is being dicsussed. It's people doing the latter which is the issue. It also happens to be the main repsonse. I suspect this is because you can't prove me wrong about the negative aspects of Brexit. Once again. The simple challenge is there prove me wrong. Just going to personal insults strengthens my case and makes you look petty.
 
Saying you want a grown up conversation yet will treat others with contempt if they try to defend Brexit shows a bewildering lack of self awareness.

Carry on trying to assuage your guilt for voting for Brexit by proxy.
 
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