Irish now suspend Astra Zeneca vaccine

So these people will have suffered blood clots come what may? They just so happened to have had a recent AZ vaccine resulting in uproar. You can make stats read what you want them to read and this madness confirms it. Send the vaccines over to the more sensible countries so they can get used ASAP.
 
bear66 said:
This is the best explanation I've seen of why they've suspended use.
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Doesn't seem to be much reason to do it even with that.

The incidence rate of these blood clots seems so low as to be statistically insignificant.

Norway were also the ones to spread a bit of panic after very elderly care home patients died after vaccination, despite their deaths being unrelated to the vaccine and due to their age.
 
How well have Ireland, Norway, Denmark and Iceland handled the pandemic in general so far, does anyone know?
 
Doom_On_Horseback said:
Anybody else's FB doom monger friends having a field day with this news or is it just mine?
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Some on my timeline as well. Idiots that after all this is over I think I will continue to have less to do with.

Further up the thread someone quoted the Irish Govt using the "Precautionary Principle". Thats doing a hell of a lot of heavy lifting. The stats as far as I can dig them out of the UK numbers are that for both Pfizer & AZ approx 10m doses of each have been given with 13 Oxford then reporting Blood Clots and 15 Pfizer reporting Blood Clots. Even weighting for the age profiles of those given the vaccine thats a lower rate than would be expected of 2 equivalent 10m populations.

Here's a thought. We know from recent figures that without the vaccine you do stand a GREATER chance of going into hospital and dying from Covid rather than taking the vaccine and having a lower chance than the general population of getting a blood clot from which you would not die

Not a big fan of British exceptionalism but on vaccines and data analysis and medical risk assessment we are light years ahead of the rest of the EU.

Just had another search and this Austrian guy explains it way better - need google translate from German on

https://twitter.com/x/status/1371033872046166025
 
Interesting thread this, lots of statistical references.

The statistics are fine unless you are the exception.

The vaccines have been rushed out.

I think the medics are right to be cautious if they see any problems.
 
HolgateCorner said:
Interesting thread this, lots of statistical references.

The statistics are fine unless you are the exception.

The vaccines have been rushed out.

I think the medics are right to be cautious if they see any problems.
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I understand your thinking but the vaccines haven't been rushed they've been expedited. And with good reason they are our only way out of this mess.
 
I haven't read much on this but I thought it was batch specific rather than the whole vaccine when the decision was initially made.
 
chickenrunner said:
I understand your thinking but the vaccines haven't been rushed they've been expedited. And with good reason they are our only way out of this mess.
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The trials normally take much longer to see if they are safe.

There is a hereditary blood clot problem in my wife’s family so she is now worried about having the vaccine, she’s going to talk to her doctor

There may not be an issue but it’s good that alarm bells are ringing.

Too many on this thread prepared to play fast and loose in my opinion just to ‘get it done’.
 
HolgateCorner said:
The trials normally take much longer to see if they are safe.
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Trials usually take much longer because of the struggle to secure funding, commercial loss of interest, rounding up volunteers, etc., etc., ...................
HolgateCorner said:
Too many on this thread prepared to play fast and loose in my opinion just to ‘get it done’.
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No one is being forced to have the vaccine which is absolutely as it should be. People have assessed the risk as you have but come to a different conclusion. I stand fully with anyone who decides the vaccine is not for them BUT not if they try to justify their decision by trying to create fear and uncertainty in others particularly by promoting disinformation.
 
chickenrunner said:
Trials usually take much longer because of the struggle to secure funding, commercial loss of interest, rounding up volunteers, etc., etc., ...................

No one is being forced to have the vaccine which is absolutely as it should be. People have assessed the risk as you have but come to a different conclusion. I stand fully with anyone who decides the vaccine is not for them BUT not if they try to justify their decision by trying to create fear and uncertainty in others particularly by promoting disinformation.
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It’s not disinformation though is it?

Look, I’ve had my first jab, I think it’s a risk with the vaccine being developed so quickly but I’ve decided to have it.

But we shouldn’t sweep any potential problems under the carpet just because it isn’t what we want to hear.
 
My understanding is that Spain is not using any more unused doses from the batch that is under discussion. They are continuing to use all other batches of the AZ vaccine.

A sensible approach I think.
 
HolgateCorner said:
It’s not disinformation though is it?
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In the case of the potential connection between AZ and blood clots no it's not. But given the incidence level (if there is a connection) and given that most of these governments must still be vaccinating the most vulnerable elements of society they are potentially exposing those people to a greater degree of risk in delaying their vaccine programs. The saying 'never take counsel of your fears' comes to mind.

All that said I understand that people find it easier to accept that someone got unlucky, caught Covid and died than if they decided to get to get vaccinated to protect themselves and that was ultimately to cause their demise.
 
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