Worldwide Phenomenon

Let’s face it there’s a lot dodgy about a lot of things . Stats in every country won’t be done the same so can’t be compared . Covid patients are been treat more important than those with cancer and other illnesses Despite a a ridiculously lower death rate .
lots of Shadiness across the board
 
No conspiracy talk here.
Looking for reasons.

Have labs lowered the cycle count as the WHO recommended a few weeks back (please note the information regarding this has been deleted from the WHO website).

Has the virus acted like a fire? Is it simply running out of fuel?
 
Statistically just about impossible
Why?

Can you show your working?

I'd guess the main driver is Trump no longer calling the shots.

Biden has already changed the overall arc of the US narrative from 'the virus is a hoax' to 'wear masks; stay safe'.

It doesn't take long to drive down infections. The problem is that those already infected are able to spread asymptomatically and may end up as ICU patients in another couple of weeks.

If the ICU numbers drop at a similar rate in a few weeks then there's nothing dodgy about it at all.
 
Why?

Can you show your working?

I'd guess the main driver is Trump no longer calling the shots.

Biden has already changed the overall arc of the US narrative from 'the virus is a hoax' to 'wear masks; stay safe'.

It doesn't take long to drive down infections. The problem is that those already infected are able to spread asymptomatically and may end up as ICU patients in another couple of weeks.

If the ICU numbers drop at a similar rate in a few weeks then there's nothing dodgy about it at all.

Seriously Trump going has brought down cases worldwide regardless of restrictions. I mean it's fine to hate the guy but can you seriously be that into it? 😂

No point making this thread though @Randy people can't change the way they look at this thing.
 
Let’s face it there’s a lot dodgy about a lot of things . Stats in every country won’t be done the same so can’t be compared . Covid patients are been treat more important than those with cancer and other illnesses Despite a a ridiculously lower death rate .
lots of Shadiness across the board
Thats not the case at all
 
Seriously Trump going has brought down cases worldwide regardless of restrictions. I mean it's fine to hate the guy but can you seriously be that into it? 😂

No point making this thread though @Randy people can't change the way they look at this thing.

Seriously Trump going has brought down cases worldwide regardless of restrictions. I mean it's fine to hate the guy but can you seriously be that into it? 😂

No point making this thread though @Randy people can't change the way they look at this thing.
Something is obviously changing. Lots of different strategies around the globe too.
 
No conspiracy talk here.
Looking for reasons.

Have labs lowered the cycle count as the WHO recommended a few weeks back (please note the information regarding this has been deleted from the WHO website).

Has the virus acted like a fire? Is it simply running out of fuel?
I'm no expert but I genuinely think it's the latter. It seems to have a lot of mutations at the moment that are very very infectious. That's bad news shoot term but good news long term as it'll soon run out of hosts to infect. Or at least low enough for it to be tolerable.
 
In Europe and the US, Christmas probably accounted for a lot of infections in December, then hospitalizations in January.

The effects of lockdowns, working at home, people being more sensible, cold weather keeping people indoors, and vaccinations have probably contributed to the falls.

The acid test will be what happens after lockdowns are ended, and as people go outside to socialize more again.
 
Seriously Trump going has brought down cases worldwide regardless of restrictions. I mean it's fine to hate the guy but can you seriously be that into it? 😂

No point making this thread though @Randy people can't change the way they look at this thing.
The original post was an article about the US.

If people have changed their behaviour since Trump left then the number of infections might well be down.

Which is why calling it a statistical impossibility without showing why needs calling out.

I'm not suggesting for one second that I'm correct - just that there is a perfetly reasonable explanation as to why this isn't impossible.
 
I'm no expert but I genuinely think....

This is one of the problems we face not just with covid but all manner of things - quite possibly with the Daily Mail journalists who made the story in the OP.

Non-experts expressing their opinions on a complex issue.
 
This is one of the problems we face not just with covid but all manner of things - quite possibly with the Daily Mail journalists who made the story in the OP.

Non-experts expressing their opinions on a complex issue.
I don't think there was anything wrong with the way I expressed my thoughts here. It's a public forum, the exact place opinions are shared, especially from none experts.
Do we need some form of epidemiology qualification before we can reply to a thread?
 
The numbers/ curve shapes aren't that much different to ours, but there's a simple explanation.

December is the most amount of mixing of any month the whole year, so the increase is sort of turbo boosted, difficult to maintain this increase, or maintain those cases, at lesser contact times
Christmas = Turbo boost of the turbo boost, an increased level which is unsustainable (especially with the shortly followed lockdowns etc).
The peak lasts a short while as you've got Christmas day (week) mixing and then the additional time for people to transmit to their wives and kids, and then incubation periods. This is why it increased the 7 day average, and that's why the peak shows a little after. Also people will have delayed getting tests.

So, of that high, about 20% of it probably isn't "natural", it's artificial, as in wouldn't be sustained during normal tomes of normal transmission. So where the USA had a 250k peak, it should probably have been looked at like 200k (minus Christmas day anomaly and it's knock on effect).

Then after that you go into January, which is the least amount of mixing in the year, everyone turns into a hermit, saves money, tries to be "good". Then go and combine this with masses of cases and death, people feeling guilty from Christmas, a tight lock down, schools mostly shut etc, etc, the list is endless.

It's a slightly quicker decrease than I was expecting (for them, and us), but the extra is possibly, related to the vaccines and could be assisted by immunity built up from the $hit loads that have been infected recently.

So, it's not a "real" 44% drop, as it shouldn't have been that high in the first place, the "top" is measuring from an artificial/ unsustainable peak.
 
The numbers/ curve shapes aren't that much different to ours, but there's a simple explanation.

December is the most amount of mixing of any month the whole year, so the increase is sort of turbo boosted, difficult to maintain this increase, or maintain those cases, at lesser contact times
Christmas = Turbo boost of the turbo boost, an increased level which is unsustainable (especially with the shortly followed lockdowns etc).
The peak lasts a short while as you've got Christmas day (week) mixing and then the additional time for people to transmit to their wives and kids, and then incubation periods. This is why it increased the 7 day average, and that's why the peak shows a little after. Also people will have delayed getting tests.

So, of that high, about 20% of it probably isn't "natural", it's artificial, as in wouldn't be sustained during normal tomes of normal transmission. So where the USA had a 250k peak, it should probably have been looked at like 200k (minus Christmas day anomaly and it's knock on effect).

Then after that you go into January, which is the least amount of mixing in the year, everyone turns into a hermit, saves money, tries to be "good". Then go and combine this with masses of cases and death, people feeling guilty from Christmas, a tight lock down, schools mostly shut etc, etc, the list is endless.

It's a slightly quicker decrease than I was expecting (for them, and us), but the extra is possibly, related to the vaccines and could be assisted by immunity built up from the $hit loads that have been infected recently.

So, it's not a "real" 44% drop, as it shouldn't have been that high in the first place, the "top" is measuring from an artificial/ unsustainable peak.

That explanation is based on a massive flawed assumption that Christmas is the "turbo boost of the turbo boost" in the US. Thanksgiving (4 weeks before) is by far the biggest time when families get together and mix, not Christmas and Christmas day.
 
That explanation is based on a massive flawed assumption that Christmas is the "turbo boost of the turbo boost" in the US. Thanksgiving (4 weeks before) is by far the biggest time when families get together and mix, not Christmas and Christmas day.
You could have a point there, for the USA, but I don't think "thanksgiving" is "by far" bigger, but it probably is bigger. But, the USA had a dip in recording before their peak, which is probably recording problems due to Christmas. The area of the increase over 200k was roughly similar to the area below 200k just before it (it evens out).

So basically the peak was still around a natural 200k (just starting earlier with thanksgiving), it would be easier to see if looking over 14 day av or 21 day av.

It looks like there was a unsustainable increase/ peak (for that time) around thanksgiving, then a dip (both expected), but then the curve goes back to it's natural progression. Then drops again due to Christmas under recording (green arrow), which then gets picked up just after, along with the increase in cases due to it. The "natural" ceiling level of the curve was just above 200k. If the transmission goes above/ below the curve (which would be steady) then it can play havoc with a graph, you just need to figure out a trendline. But big meet up days and non-recoding days at the same time cause the fake dips and peaks.

Hard to be exact with dates, as that graph is very badly dated (intentionally I expect).

1612456402216.png
 
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The original post was an article about the US.

If people have changed their behaviour since Trump left then the number of infections might well be down.

Which is why calling it a statistical impossibility without showing why needs calling out.

I'm not suggesting for one second that I'm correct - just that there is a perfetly reasonable explanation as to why this isn't impossible.
The differences and similarities between Florida and California over the past few months have been interesting aswell.
Does climate play a part after all?
 
You could have a point there, for the USA, but I don't think "thanksgiving" is "by far" bigger, but it probably is bigger.

Having lived there I can assure you it is. Most people travel to families for Thanksgiving, many don't for Christmas (obviously a decent proportion don't even celebrate it).
 
Do we need some form of epidemiology qualification before we can reply to a thread?

If the thread is on epidemiology then quite frankly, yes, unless you're asking for answers.

The internet is full of non-experts giving advice and as a result the internet is full of cranks and their 5G anti-vac nonsense.

Don't get me wrong ST, I'm not having a go at you per se, just making a point in general.
 
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