Warnock has claimed a historic victory in his Georgia senate race!

futureboy said:
Boro jokes aside - this could be an historic moment. Fingers crossed that this is the start of something big and positive in that beautiful but broken country. Still waiting for the result of the other runoff, but Ossoff seems to be in control
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It won't be. The Democrats make Keir Starmer look strong. At best we'll get the US signing up to the Paris climate accords but they won't actually fix any of the problems that caused Trump to get elected in the first place.
 
Ferrosol said:
It won't be. The Democrats make Keir Starmer look strong. At best we'll get the US signing up to the Paris climate accords but they won't actually fix any of the problems that caused Trump to get elected in the first place.
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You expect them to fix two centuries of racism, and a century of right wing free market anti socialism ideology in 4 years???

It's a long term job to undo the ideological fundamentalist capitalism that has been taught at schools, and has become a part of the national psyche through media. Of course this has been done via fear mongering that a single socialist policy means you are a socialist ideologist (yet those who try and remove government involvement in any commercial business are not held to the same yardstick!) and that socialism means increasing the taxes for everyone....neither are true. Resetting the overton window is a long term activity but in both the US and the UK it needs to be done.

This pandemic, the 2007 crash, 1990 crash, black monday these things prove the toxicity of not creating strong governing over businesses. If you don't create rules the rich and the powerful will screw everyone over, crash the markets and you and I pay to fix it. Free market economics is bunk. It's time for balanced politics, adult politics, non-extremist politics, pragmatic politics.
 
They only have 2 years to get the really important things through.
2022 sees 34 Senate seats up for election. By that time as the governing party the Democrats should see a decline in their popularity so they could possibly lose seats
 
Ferrosol said:
It won't be. The Democrats make Keir Starmer look strong. At best we'll get the US signing up to the Paris climate accords but they won't actually fix any of the problems that caused Trump to get elected in the first place.
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At least, assuming the other Georgia seat goes to the Dems, the Republicans won't be able to block legislation in the Senate, which was really what did for Obama's term in office.
 
BoroMart said:
You expect them to fix two centuries of racism, and a century of right wing free market anti socialism ideology in 4 years???

It's a long term job to undo the ideological fundamentalist capitalism that has been taught at schools, and has become a part of the national psyche through media. Of course this has been done via fear mongering that a single socialist policy means you are a socialist ideologist (yet those who try and remove government involvement in any commercial business are not held to the same yardstick!) and that socialism means increasing the taxes for everyone....neither are true. Resetting the overton window is a long term activity but in both the US and the UK it needs to be done.

This pandemic, the 2007 crash, 1990 crash, black monday these things prove the toxicity of not creating strong governing over businesses. If you don't create rules the rich and the powerful will screw everyone over, crash the markets and you and I pay to fix it. Free market economics is bunk. It's time for balanced politics, adult politics, non-extremist politics, pragmatic politics.
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You're making the very big assumption that the democrats want to fix any of those things. Which a bit of a leap as most of them are on the same corporate payroll as the Republicans.
 
Ferrosol said:
You're making the very big assumption that the democrats want to fix any of those things. Which a bit of a leap as most of them are on the same corporate payroll as the Republicans.
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It hasn't taken long to out this new incarnation of our regular ultra-tory who persistently undermines any left leaning politics or political figures.

In answer to your statement, Democrats are a wide range of views, AOC and Saunders do want to, some don't, some do but pretend not to because, you know the Overton window in america is off the charts.
 
Ferrosol said:
You're making the very big assumption that the democrats want to fix any of those things. Which a bit of a leap as most of them are on the same corporate payroll as the Republicans.
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Yet, during their last presidential term they managed to reform healthcare to provide it for people who can't afford it to pay for it.

Demographics in the US is shifting slowly, which matches the pace of change in American politics.
 
Chris_Boro said:
Yet, during their last presidential term they managed to reform healthcare to provide it for people who can't afford it to pay for it.

Demographics in the US is shifting slowly, which matches the pace of change in American politics.
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With a half assed republican lite plan that isn't half as good as it should have been (seriously it was a worse knock off Mitt Romney's plan) . They should have at least argued for a public option rather than giving up on it before even trying to negotiate.
BoroMart said:
It hasn't taken long to out this new incarnation of our regular ultra-tory who persistently undermines any left leaning politics or political figures.

In answer to your statement, Democrats are a wide range of views, AOC and Saunders do want to, some don't, some do but pretend not to because, you know the Overton window in america is off the charts.
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Also I'm not a tory and lol at the notion that Joe Biden is a left wing leader. He's a status quo politician who'll keep things running about the same and then he'll be beaten in 2024 by whatever Fascist the republicans put up against him. Assuming he doesn't die before then.
 
Ferrosol said:
With a half assed republican lite plan that isn't half as good as it should have been (seriously it was a worse knock off Mitt Romney's plan) . They should have at least argued for a public option rather than giving up on it before even trying to negotiate.
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Anything with strong socialist values is not going to be accepted in the US right now due to the Overton windows continual swing to the right for the last 40 years. Pragmatism is required to stop the slide right, then prove that a slide left can improve peoples lives. The US socio-political culture is as extreme to the right as any rich country in the world right now.

Ferrosol said:
Also I'm not a tory and lol at the notion that Joe Biden is a left wing leader. He's a status quo politician who'll keep things running about the same and then he'll be beaten in 2024 by whatever Fascist the republicans put up against him. Assuming he doesn't die before then.
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Sure, you always say that. I didn't claim Biden is a 'left wing leader'. I claimed he was left leaning. In terms of the Overton window he is, in that he believes in installing some practical social policies to bring balance. He isn't left in the Marxist sense,
he is left in the US political sense and will introduce some social policies, such as paying $2,000 to each struggling family in the first month and raising taxation on the richest members of society.
 
futureboy said:
Boro jokes aside - this could be an historic moment. Fingers crossed that this is the start of something big and positive in that beautiful but broken country. Still waiting for the result of the other runoff, but Ossoff seems to be in control.
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Dont think so...on the BBC live feed now go and watch the footage of Mitt Romney (one of the few standing upto to the crackpot Trump) he is in the airport lounge flying to DC from his Utah state he represents and footage of him being harassed by a loony woman and then on the plane with many chanting traitor and harassing him again. America has so many crazy people that Trump has started something (which he loves being a sociopath) which aint going to quiet down anytime soon.
Mad mad country and yet they think they are the best at everything. hilarious.
 
Ferrosol said:
With a half assed republican lite plan that isn't half as good as it should have been (seriously it was a worse knock off Mitt Romney's plan) . They should have at least argued for a public option rather than giving up on it before even trying to negotiate.

Also I'm not a tory and lol at the notion that Joe Biden is a left wing leader. He's a status quo politician who'll keep things running about the same and then he'll be beaten in 2024 by whatever Fascist the republicans put up against him. Assuming he doesn't die before then.
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What is your point?

Democrats are not socialists, but they are to the left of the GOP. There was not a chance that an NHS style healthcare bill would pass through the Senate, anything that helps the poorer American will face blockers from the right which includes some Democrats, getting anything through was a miracle.

Demographics are key drivers in US politics. A Democrat can be a liberal candidate in California and win but would be laughed at in Texas. This is changing very slowly as more people move away from expensive urban states and bringing social votes with them.

Biden is a transitional President to calm things down, I do not expect any dramatic policies from him.
 
Chris_Boro said:
Yet, during their last presidential term they managed to reform healthcare to provide it for people who can't afford it to pay for it.

Demographics in the US is shifting slowly, which matches the pace of change in American politics.
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By reform you mean re-brand Mitt Romney and the Heritage Foundation’s Republican healthcare plan.

How bold of Obama to introduce a right wing healthcare plan when he was one short of a super majority in Congress.
 
Absolutely buzzing it looks like the Senate is going Dem. I didn't see this coming at all, especially during the Presidential election saga whilst confirming Biden. Honestly, I thought the Senate would stay GOP and fell asleep overnight watching CNN updates, thought at least one seat was going GOP. This just gets funnier by the minute, Trump must be holding Mike Pence at gunpoint as we speak ha ha ha

I read an article today by James Comey. He says when Trump leaves office, he should be let free of his wrongdoings. Coming from Comey, that was a disappointing thing to hear. People have served time for far less than what Trump has done before and during his corrupt Presidency.

What is his defence??? Insanity?? Were all those dodgy phone calls, not just Ukraine but many others and most recently the one where he's asking to 'find votes' to overturn a state .. it's not just stupidity or naivety. The guy is a crook and needs to be paying for it in one way or another. It makes you wonder just how much else he's done in Office in violation of the oath he swore before entering office.

What kind of precedent does it set to just let a man like him walk free?? American politics will be ruined forever if this man isn't given the punishment he deserves. It's infuriating that he's going to just walk out there a free man, living in bliss in Florida or where ever he chooses having left the whole US political system in complete disarray and left well over 70 million brainwashed Americans determined to find the next clown to enter the Oval.

It doesn't just damage affairs over there either, the clowns we have in Govt now are a mini version of what we see over there, and it makes me fear about what the future holds.
 
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