Trident missile test fails for second time in a row

Lottowyn said:
The point of the nuclear deterrent is that the opposition is deterred from firing their weapons because they believe you would retaliate (in this case from our subs). If they know our nuclear deterrent doesn’t function then the opposition can attack without any threat of retaliation.
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The deterrent has worked though, nobody has dropped a nuke on people since the Americans in the 40's. Nobody having nukes would be a better idea of course, and save a lot of money all round, but it's not likely to happen anytime soon.

It does function though, the reason they do tests is to expand the envelope and identify faults. Or, do you think they're still testing the same things they were 5,10,20,40 years ago etc? The Vanguards were designed in the 70's and arrived in the 80's, they won't have been sailing around for 40 years not being able to work. We used to say in the RAF that our jets never worked (can't even remember if we were joking), and they were always having all sorts of faults in testing, but when they came to being needed they did their job exceptionally well.

Even the operators won't know much about what a test may be specifically testing, that's how the military works, basically just do what you're told, because someone above you was doing what they're told and so on. With a lot of secret things like this you have to go up a hell of a lot of levels before you get to someone who really knows what is going on, and why.

I wouldn't be surprised in the slightest if the tests they're doing now are more for the next class of submarines which are due in service in the early 30's. It's not like BAE are going to be allowed to sail a nuclear sub to the coast of the USA and start firing off missiles etc.

The press do a good job of getting the whole thing wrong, through lack of understanding and also through being intentionally misled, to me it's like one big act, until it's needed, then it gets fully proven etc.
 
I'm not against having the deterrent, as mad as it sounds, I think nukes will save more lives than they kill, in so much as they will sort of prevent major world wars. There's no way to know if this has been true to date or would be in the future mind. I'm massively against the cost though. Sure, it's always going to be expensive, but there will be exceptional waste, as there always was in the forces (from my experience anyway), as well as we will be getting raped on price, like how happens with any complex system.

It's interesting though, as a few years back I would have said that what we have is not necessary (nuclear subs) if we're friends with the Americans, as we use the same missiles I think, and as we're quite pally, they would help us in a worse case scenario no doubt. I'm not as sure on that now mind, especially with Trump threatening to leave NATO, who absurdly could get back in as president. I doubt they could or would leave NATO mind, but it would be interesting (probably the wrong word) if they did, as I'm not sure how that would work for us and our deals with them. We would possibly have to give up the subs, and go back to air launched nukes, or just give them up altogether. We're not as pally with the EU now, so can't imagine one of those would want to go in with us on something so critical.

Having the best weapons or Nuclear subs sort of seemed important when we were dominant on the world stage, or high level, but we're losing our position fast, or can't afford such things, so it kind of makes me just think, why bother spending the money.
 
northernrower said:
Everything was ****ed when I was on there. I guess the old girl was just a bit tired 🤣

With reference to the test, and without going too technical, the missiles had just been put back on the boat after it had an extensive re-fit, so they required a test. The fact that it failed is massively embarrassing for the RN, but the whole reason for a test launch is to highlight potential issues and rectify them. We can all be assured that the issue will have been promptly fixed.

In all seriousness, it's a bloody good boat with a great crew. She's the lead V-boat in the class, and I'd trust her to do a job if the time ever comes.
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It’s ok, I’ve done a few DASOs, know what they’re all about..

This failure wasn’t due to the material state of the boat or the capability of the crew though..

It was a failure of the telemetry missile… the boat executed a perfect launch, it’s the yank missile that failed..🤷🏼‍♂️
 
Fair bit of embarrassment for the navy and government but ultimately the submarine which is British built did its job and launched the missle. The first stage didn’t ignite. The yanks and Lockheed will be the ones who have to figure out what went wrong and fix it if need be.

Im not surprised how much attention this story got, but there’s been a far more worrying story hit the press regarding these boats in the last few months in my opinion.

Crush depth

 
Andy_W said:
The deterrent has worked though, nobody has dropped a nuke on people since the Americans in the 40's. Nobody having nukes would be a better idea of course, and save a lot of money all round, but it's not likely to happen anytime soon.

It does function though, the reason they do tests is to expand the envelope and identify faults. Or, do you think they're still testing the same things they were 5,10,20,40 years ago etc? The Vanguards were designed in the 70's and arrived in the 80's, they won't have been sailing around for 40 years not being able to work. We used to say in the RAF that our jets never worked (can't even remember if we were joking), and they were always having all sorts of faults in testing, but when they came to being needed they did their job exceptionally well.

Even the operators won't know much about what a test may be specifically testing, that's how the military works, basically just do what you're told, because someone above you was doing what they're told and so on. With a lot of secret things like this you have to go up a hell of a lot of levels before you get to someone who really knows what is going on, and why.

I wouldn't be surprised in the slightest if the tests they're doing now are more for the next class of submarines which are due in service in the early 30's. It's not like BAE are going to be allowed to sail a nuclear sub to the coast of the USA and start firing off missiles etc.

The press do a good job of getting the whole thing wrong, through lack of understanding and also through being intentionally misled, to me it's like one big act, until it's needed, then it gets fully proven etc.
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The press getting things wrong is very true.

Always used to surprise me when defence correspondents, from the broadsheets, would get the most basic technical info wrong about aircraft.
 
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