r00fie1
Well-known member
Game in hand - up to 50 points, only 7 behind Hull.
Anything is possible........[Am I on LSD or having a strange dream]?
* The Unofficial “Official” Boro v Norwich [03/24] Match-Day Thread *
- Thread starter r00fie1
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Anything is possible........[Am I on LSD or having a strange dream]?
TeessideCleveland
Well-known member
Really need him from now until the end of the season - hope he's ok for Saturday and TuesdayGood to see a middle-aged bloke smile
Give him a new contract and don't pzz him about!
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r00fie1
Well-known member
Reminds me a bit of John stead, but John's legs had gone by the time he was Jonny's age.
Whilst he's still more valuable than half the squad — in terms of leadership and quality — we need to reward him.
He also acts as “champion” and mentor for the young academy lads, so is more than just our best midfielder, along with Hayden.
Andy_W
Well-known member
I think you and Nano might be talking about different things.
If they're both stood two feet away and have a split second to make a decision, or are both in a like for like situation then yes, you're 100% correct, the ref will come out on top.
But if the fan (or most commentators) have seen 5 replays that the ref hasn't, then it's probably 60/30 in favour of the fan/ commentator, and 10% they both get it wrong.
The only reason it wouldn't be 100% for the fan is because there's probably more bias in fans, and quite a lot of them don't know every rule (myself included).
Obviously the most accurate would be a ref with all the time, angles, and rule knowledge, but even then VAR can be wrong sometimes too.
Laughing
Well-known member
This is nonsense Andy. Half of football fans don't even know the rules controlling the game.
Var, generally supports the refs decision and doesn't overrule it.
Sometimes a ref doesn't see an incident. In this example the ref is stood on top of the incident and it doesn't happen at pace either.
The ref saw the incident clearly and sent the player off, I see no reason to assume he got it wrong.
Andy_W
Well-known member
Of course it's not, most fans who would be commenting would at least know most of the rules, but sure they may not know some of the more detailed rules.
For my third paragraph I was talking about more contentious decisions, where replays are a massive advantage etc, not the simple/ obvious stuff and this wasn't that simple imo.
By VAR, I mean even when the refs go over to the screen they can still get it wrong, but would usually get it right, that's all part of VAR. A lot of the time if the ref's got it right (which will be luck, in a lot of instances), then VAR is just going to basically prove he was right, which increases the certainty.
For that one (or most red card decisions), I would say I've got a pretty good idea of what is an isn't a red, and would probably have a more accurate opinion than the ref looking at it for 0.1 seconds and no replays. The problem with that one I suppose is down to interpretation, it didn't really look like to me that he kicked out initially, on like 3 replays, but also it didn't really look like he tried to bring his foot down either (maybe due to holding hamstring trying to get a foul himself?). The both went in pretty heavy on the initial tackle, but neither was worse than each other on that aspect.
Their lad was spun round and his feet were in the air through momentum (or holding his hamstring) before he was even looking at Howson, then he made very slight contact, and then possible contact again a second time (unsure if this was also momentum), but from two angles it looked pretty soft. It wasn't exactly dangerous (nowhere near as dangerous as either of them in the tackle), so can't be serious foul play for that, but could have been excessive force (although little force).
I think it's difficult on this one to say either way with certainty, the ref had a good position but it didn't even look like he was looking at that, he'd turned to where the ball was 20 yards away.
I still can't make my mind up to be honest. Norwich are thinking of appealing it, but I doubt they will as it's difficult to prove either way, so everyone will have to assume the decision was right. This doesn't mean that watching replays isn't more accurate than the ref though, in general.
Couple of good angles here, which I don't think we saw at the time last night.
https://x.com/joegibney15/status/1765531835692396680?s=20
VAR supports the refs decisions when the ref gets it right but it doesn't support them when it gets them wrong. Sometimes the ref gets it wrong but it's subjective and so the decision doesn't get overturned which is not the same as the ref being right. We don't need to talk generally when we can be specific about this situation. There have been 69 decisions overturned by VAR in the PL this season so far. It's hardly a shock that a referee got a decision wrong: https://www.espn.co.uk/football/sto...-decisions-affect-premier-league-club-2023-24
The ref saw what he thought he saw just like every other ref that got a decision wrong. The ref saw that there was contact and made the decision that it was an act of aggression but that isn't supported by the video evidence.
Are you actually saying that the referee can't have been wrong? We don't need to side with him because we have video evidence. We can see what happened pretty clearly. If you were arguing between the referee and the fans in the stand then I agree that I would side with the ref and give him the benefit of the doubt but we have replays from several angles in slow mo and full speed and there isn't a single one which shows anything like a kick-out so either the referee has seen something incorrectly or all the video angles have missed it.
Laughing
Well-known member
You are, of course entitled to your opinion.
The ref saw it and considered it to be a retaliatory kick. I see no reason to assume he was wrong.
Whether it was a soft red card or not is immaterial. It was a red card under the rules of the game. He kicked out at an opponent after the ball had gone.
The ref thought it was a sending off, the Norwich players didn't make a fuss so they thought it was a sending off too.
It was a red card every day of the week and there is no way the decision gets overturned at appeal.
Rofesleg
Well-known member
Stead was a 6'4" beanpole journeyman striker wasn't he? Didn't he play for about 15 clubs? Until he found his forever home Notts County in his 30s.Reminds me a bit of John stead, but John's legs had gone by the time he was Jonny's age.
Whilst he's still more valuable than half the squad — in terms of leadership and quality — we need to reward him.
He also acts as “champion” and mentor for the young academy lads, so is more than just our best midfielder, along with Hayden.
I'm sure Howson will love that comparison
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