The human cost of cancelling the eastern leg of HS2
- Thread starter Trug
- Start date
r00fie1
Well-known member
Not only that, but detailed geological surveys and mapping has taken place on the proposed route and all the public authorities and stakeholders have input thousands of hours and finance on consultants and planners, to present a positive business case for the line. Its that initial investment which is a real kick in the nuts for all those who have worked so hard.
I`ve some sympathy for those who claim its blighted their homes, but they dont bat an eyelid to building by-passes and tarmac expansion impacting on other peoples lives. This is not about installing a new set of traffic lights or a mini - roundabout, this is about increasing the capacity of the line to take the freight and passenger traffic off existing lines [and off the roads] - some of which are almost 170 years old - and build for the future.
If we want a modern infrastructure, we need a modern public transport system. Motorways plough through villages and cut towns in half [like Long Eaton] and cause planning blight - but its accepted? Why, because the case for the car is accepted as default.
If you look at the M1 and converted it into a railway line - you could have 6 tracks of continuous welded rail with all the signalling and electric power cables and stantions in situ. The hills and gradients wouldnt present a problem to modern electric traction and there would be no historic "pinch-points". That is a simplistic view - but realistic nonetheless.
Take that as the default and divert all the traffic on the M1, to the pre-motorway "A" roads - which includes those which go through towns. This is effectively what the end of the Birmingham - East Midlands [Toton] Hub - Sheffield - Leeds HS2 has done to rail. The lines from New Street to Leeds City are old routes, totally unfit for purpose, constricted geographically and physically. They cant just be straightened out and speed limits increased to 150 MPH. Almost the entire route was initially built to carry coal traffic and heavy freight [1840 - 1860]! Train paths cant be inserted like leggo bricks in a wall. The older lines simply cannot take more traffic - which means longer journeys, more delays, cancellations, signalling problems, continuous ongoing major engineering to keep embankments, bridges and tunnels safe, etc, etc.
Other than the route from London to Ashford for the channel Tunnel, the last new main-line in our country was opened in 1898! That was the Great Central from Sheffield Victoria - Nottingham Victoria - Leicester Central - Rugby Central and London Marylebone. It was built by a Sir Edward Watkin whose intention it was to build a "Channel Tunnel" connecting the line to the continent. To that end, the line had wide sweeping curves and long straight sections with a gradient of less than 1 / 176 over the whole line. It was built to continental loading gauge - unlike all other railway lines in the British Isles!
Unfortunately [and typical of this country] it was the last main line to be closed, after a short life of less than 70 years, under the watchfull eye of Ernest Marples and Dr Beeching.
This latest u-turn is the most short sighted, London - centric, politically motivated, flip-up in decades. Our planning process for rail has to be completly reformed. The existing system isnt fit for purpose. We need an organisaiton akin to Highways England - Railways UK - with its own priorities, links into formally structured regional bodies and a plan. Not directed by Civil Servants and politicians by the Thames. Highways England needs to stop immediately, the infill of cuttings and bulldozing of embankments for road development. Many of the calls for reopening former lines face huge obstacles - such as roads cutting through the trackbed and formation - which means a rebuild of the road as well as rail - at enormous cost. There is so much which is skewed against public transport in our country: perhaps this balls - up [or "V" UP to the "North"] will form a platform [pardon the pun] for a complete over-hall of just how public transport investment and management works [or in this case doesnt].
Whilst some say "yippee" - I want to know how they propose we as a country tell the people who use rail, why they have got to put up with longer delays, crowded trains, slower services and failing infrastructure? And what happens to the increasing tonnage of freight which pounds our countries roads? Becasue thats going to effect Reginald Molehusband in his 4X4. He wont be able to break the speed limit on the M1 stood idle in yet another traffic jam! Thats when those who say "yipee" get bitten on the arz.
What do the NIMBY`s propose we do as a country? Its not a "rail problem" - its our problem - one of inadequate infrastructure. An infrastructure which is preventing investment in the North and keeping people in low paid jobs or on the dole queue. Government Departments and Independent organisations are not going to head North without reliable, clean, fast, efficient, infrastructure.
So do we just carry on in this anarchic fashion - using a sticking plaster to cover thrombosis and hope for the best?
Liar Johnson doesnt give a schitt - thats what lies at the end of the line - and it will probably be his derailing too......
I`ve some sympathy for those who claim its blighted their homes, but they dont bat an eyelid to building by-passes and tarmac expansion impacting on other peoples lives. This is not about installing a new set of traffic lights or a mini - roundabout, this is about increasing the capacity of the line to take the freight and passenger traffic off existing lines [and off the roads] - some of which are almost 170 years old - and build for the future.
If we want a modern infrastructure, we need a modern public transport system. Motorways plough through villages and cut towns in half [like Long Eaton] and cause planning blight - but its accepted? Why, because the case for the car is accepted as default.
If you look at the M1 and converted it into a railway line - you could have 6 tracks of continuous welded rail with all the signalling and electric power cables and stantions in situ. The hills and gradients wouldnt present a problem to modern electric traction and there would be no historic "pinch-points". That is a simplistic view - but realistic nonetheless.
Take that as the default and divert all the traffic on the M1, to the pre-motorway "A" roads - which includes those which go through towns. This is effectively what the end of the Birmingham - East Midlands [Toton] Hub - Sheffield - Leeds HS2 has done to rail. The lines from New Street to Leeds City are old routes, totally unfit for purpose, constricted geographically and physically. They cant just be straightened out and speed limits increased to 150 MPH. Almost the entire route was initially built to carry coal traffic and heavy freight [1840 - 1860]! Train paths cant be inserted like leggo bricks in a wall. The older lines simply cannot take more traffic - which means longer journeys, more delays, cancellations, signalling problems, continuous ongoing major engineering to keep embankments, bridges and tunnels safe, etc, etc.
Other than the route from London to Ashford for the channel Tunnel, the last new main-line in our country was opened in 1898! That was the Great Central from Sheffield Victoria - Nottingham Victoria - Leicester Central - Rugby Central and London Marylebone. It was built by a Sir Edward Watkin whose intention it was to build a "Channel Tunnel" connecting the line to the continent. To that end, the line had wide sweeping curves and long straight sections with a gradient of less than 1 / 176 over the whole line. It was built to continental loading gauge - unlike all other railway lines in the British Isles!
Unfortunately [and typical of this country] it was the last main line to be closed, after a short life of less than 70 years, under the watchfull eye of Ernest Marples and Dr Beeching.
This latest u-turn is the most short sighted, London - centric, politically motivated, flip-up in decades. Our planning process for rail has to be completly reformed. The existing system isnt fit for purpose. We need an organisaiton akin to Highways England - Railways UK - with its own priorities, links into formally structured regional bodies and a plan. Not directed by Civil Servants and politicians by the Thames. Highways England needs to stop immediately, the infill of cuttings and bulldozing of embankments for road development. Many of the calls for reopening former lines face huge obstacles - such as roads cutting through the trackbed and formation - which means a rebuild of the road as well as rail - at enormous cost. There is so much which is skewed against public transport in our country: perhaps this balls - up [or "V" UP to the "North"] will form a platform [pardon the pun] for a complete over-hall of just how public transport investment and management works [or in this case doesnt].
Whilst some say "yippee" - I want to know how they propose we as a country tell the people who use rail, why they have got to put up with longer delays, crowded trains, slower services and failing infrastructure? And what happens to the increasing tonnage of freight which pounds our countries roads? Becasue thats going to effect Reginald Molehusband in his 4X4. He wont be able to break the speed limit on the M1 stood idle in yet another traffic jam! Thats when those who say "yipee" get bitten on the arz.
What do the NIMBY`s propose we do as a country? Its not a "rail problem" - its our problem - one of inadequate infrastructure. An infrastructure which is preventing investment in the North and keeping people in low paid jobs or on the dole queue. Government Departments and Independent organisations are not going to head North without reliable, clean, fast, efficient, infrastructure.
So do we just carry on in this anarchic fashion - using a sticking plaster to cover thrombosis and hope for the best?
Liar Johnson doesnt give a schitt - thats what lies at the end of the line - and it will probably be his derailing too......
Archiestephens_elbow
Well-known member
Check out how much cash de fefels father and brother made out of hs2
Its obscene
Its obscene
Archiestephens_elbow
Well-known member
Bull s hit Ben at it again