Teesside airport another £20m bailout

It's a little concerning as at the end of last year they were anticipating that no further investment was going to be required.

I think their passenger number projections are wildly optimistic. I think 1 million passengers per year by 2026 is going to be a struggle.
 
Unravel_Morrison said:
It's a little concerning as at the end of last year they were anticipating that no further investment was going to be required.

I think their passenger number projections are wildly optimistic. I think 1 million passengers per year by 2026 is going to be a struggle.
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Absolutely no chance of hitting them numbers. Peel got those kind of figures but numbers were far higher leading up to it and it was a boom period right before the financial crash. With the passenger increases for what they've spent it won't be anywhere near 1m especially with cost of living crisis
 
Don't know where they would put extra passengers. Flew to Faro last week no tables in the cafe and they would not serve me food without a table number. I had waited 20 minutes to be served and was told to wait until table became free and the rejoin back of queue.
That was with only one scheduled flight. They have no facilities for more.
 
It's a disgrace that during a cost of living crisis that those on low incomes are having to subsidise an airport, which whilst it is nice to have is far from a necessity given our proximity to both Newcastle and Leeds.

For every passenger that flew from Teesside last year it cost the taxpayer £25.47, there were 18,013 flights and 78,250 passengers which gives an average of 4.3 people per flight, which is unsustainable, Newcastle had 21,421 flights and 1,024,930 passengers with an average of 47.84 people per flight and Leeds had 14,566 flights and 739,131 passengers with an average of 50.74 per flight, even Doncaster which is said to be really struggling after the collapse of FlyBe had 14,077 flights, 309,512 passengers and an average of 21.98 per flight, Teesside had a much lower terminal spend than the 3 examples above also.

The concern is that Houchen has got the figures massively wrong and whilst he's been quick in the past to blame others for their mismanagement of the airport he's actually done a much worse job and his business model makes little to no sense, Covid has just become an convenient excuse for a failure to understand the industry that started way before the pandemic.

It's a vanity project and has been used to score political points by Houchen, there can be no justification for low income families who have no hope of being able to afford to use the airport having their tax diverted to a white elephant.

I love this area and would never knock it, but sometimes reality is spun by those who stand to benefit as negativity, my concern is if Houchen's flagship airport scheme is in such mire what is the state of other projects and their finances, talking a good game is a very different beast to playing one.
 
Its a tricky one as you are very much at the mercy of the airlines. I've attempted to travel from Teesside via KLM 4 times since April and 3 out of the 4 flights were cancelled. Now this isn't the airports fault but does show how difficult it is for regional airports. If flights can't be trusted to fly then people won't use it. 1 of the flights I rebooked but time constraints meant that for the other two flights I was forced to use another airport instead.
 
American_Mary said:
It's a disgrace that during a cost of living crisis that those on low incomes are having to subsidise an airport, which whilst it is nice to have is far from a necessity given our proximity to both Newcastle and Leeds.

For every passenger that flew from Teesside last year it cost the taxpayer £25.47, there were 18,013 flights and 78,250 passengers which gives an average of 4.3 people per flight, which is unsustainable, Newcastle had 21,421 flights and 1,024,930 passengers with an average of 47.84 people per flight and Leeds had 14,566 flights and 739,131 passengers with an average of 50.74 per flight, even Doncaster which is said to be really struggling after the collapse of FlyBe had 14,077 flights, 309,512 passengers and an average of 21.98 per flight, Teesside had a much lower terminal spend than the 3 examples above also.

The concern is that Houchen has got the figures massively wrong and whilst he's been quick in the past to blame others for their mismanagement of the airport he's actually done a much worse job and his business model makes little to no sense, Covid has just become an convenient excuse for a failure to understand the industry that started way before the pandemic.

It's a vanity project and has been used to score political points by Houchen, there can be no justification for low income families who have no hope of being able to afford to use the airport having their tax diverted to a white elephant.

I love this area and would never knock it, but sometimes reality is spun by those who stand to benefit as negativity, my concern is if Houchen's flagship airport scheme is in such mire what is the state of other projects and their finances, talking a good game is a very different beast to playing one.
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That’ll be 18000 aircraft movements, not passenger aircraft.
 
HeineOtto said:
Its a tricky one as you are very much at the mercy of the airlines. I've attempted to travel from Teesside via KLM 4 times since April and 3 out of the 4 flights were cancelled. Now this isn't the airports fault but does show how difficult it is for regional airports. If flights can't be trusted to fly then people won't use it. 1 of the flights I rebooked but time constraints meant that for the other two flights I was forced to use another airport instead.
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Why did they cancel your flights, how do you know it wasn't to do with the airport ? Heathrow are telling airlines to cancel flights at the moment as they can't cope with the anticipated traffic at the moment.
 
American_Mary said:
It's a disgrace that during a cost of living crisis that those on low incomes are having to subsidise an airport, which whilst it is nice to have is far from a necessity given our proximity to both Newcastle and Leeds.

For every passenger that flew from Teesside last year it cost the taxpayer £25.47, there were 18,013 flights and 78,250 passengers which gives an average of 4.3 people per flight, which is unsustainable, Newcastle had 21,421 flights and 1,024,930 passengers with an average of 47.84 people per flight and Leeds had 14,566 flights and 739,131 passengers with an average of 50.74 per flight, even Doncaster which is said to be really struggling after the collapse of FlyBe had 14,077 flights, 309,512 passengers and an average of 21.98 per flight, Teesside had a much lower terminal spend than the 3 examples above also.

The concern is that Houchen has got the figures massively wrong and whilst he's been quick in the past to blame others for their mismanagement of the airport he's actually done a much worse job and his business model makes little to no sense, Covid has just become an convenient excuse for a failure to understand the industry that started way before the pandemic.

It's a vanity project and has been used to score political points by Houchen, there can be no justification for low income families who have no hope of being able to afford to use the airport having their tax diverted to a white elephant.

I love this area and would never knock it, but sometimes reality is spun by those who stand to benefit as negativity, my concern is if Houchen's flagship airport scheme is in such mire what is the state of other projects and their finances, talking a good game is a very different beast to playing one.
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Agree with this entirely, it's an appalling waste of public money to prop up an airport that isn't economically viable.

Houchen is a master of political spin and people are swallowing it too.

What's his response to the recently piblished child poverty figures the way, must have missed that?
 
The_Lizards_Jumpers said:
Why did they cancel your flights, how do you know it wasn't to do with the airport ? Heathrow are telling airlines to cancel flights at the moment as they can't cope with the anticipated traffic at the moment.
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KLM advised me two of them were due to disruption at Schipol. One was lack of ground crew and one because of demonstrations blocking roads to the airport but who knows if these were the truth or not
 
So, is this right?
£40 million to buy
£35 million earmarked to drawdown
£10 million given last year
£20 million given now

Total £105 million tax payers money. Comrade Ben T. must be some sort of hard-core socialist.

I flew from there a few weeks ago (due to the rail strike). Was a good experience but for that price I'd expect my own private jet and on-board masseuse.
 
American_Mary said:
It's a disgrace that during a cost of living crisis that those on low incomes are having to subsidise an airport, which whilst it is nice to have is far from a necessity given our proximity to both Newcastle and Leeds.

For every passenger that flew from Teesside last year it cost the taxpayer £25.47, there were 18,013 flights and 78,250 passengers which gives an average of 4.3 people per flight, which is unsustainable, Newcastle had 21,421 flights and 1,024,930 passengers with an average of 47.84 people per flight and Leeds had 14,566 flights and 739,131 passengers with an average of 50.74 per flight, even Doncaster which is said to be really struggling after the collapse of FlyBe had 14,077 flights, 309,512 passengers and an average of 21.98 per flight, Teesside had a much lower terminal spend than the 3 examples above also.

The concern is that Houchen has got the figures massively wrong and whilst he's been quick in the past to blame others for their mismanagement of the airport he's actually done a much worse job and his business model makes little to no sense, Covid has just become an convenient excuse for a failure to understand the industry that started way before the pandemic.

It's a vanity project and has been used to score political points by Houchen, there can be no justification for low income families who have no hope of being able to afford to use the airport having their tax diverted to a white elephant.

I love this area and would never knock it, but sometimes reality is spun by those who stand to benefit as negativity, my concern is if Houchen's flagship airport scheme is in such mire what is the state of other projects and their finances, talking a good game is a very different beast to playing one.
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American_Mary, while i agree it is a disgrace what is happening and agree with most of your post i would question the number of flights out of Teesside. Could you put a link up for the source please?

I use Teesside airport every other week and normally there are 2 KLM flights a day plus Aberdeen and at best a handful of others. There is no way Teesside Airport has more flights that Leeds Bradford and just 3,500 flights less than Newcastle.

18,013 flights in 365 days = 49.3 average number of flights per day. I am not sure if Teesside actually do 9 flights per day average.

Going back to the original discussion, KLM have reduced their flights to/from Teesside and also use Teesside as a favourite flight to cancel at the moment so others have already moved their routine flights to Newcastle. The London flights I was using also went so I am now stuck going via Schiphol and book the day earlier than necessary to account for cancellations.
The price factor also comes into it. If I was personally paying to fly KLM ( which I am not), then I would always use Newcastle as it is so much cheaper even given the parking and petrol.

I love using Teesside Airport but it is simply not sustainable given the price factor and choice available from Newcastle and/or Leeds Bradford.
 
HeineOtto said:
KLM advised me two of them were due to disruption at Schipol. One was lack of ground crew and one because of demonstrations blocking roads to the airport but who knows if these were the truth or not
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To be fair to klm and Teesside this is happening with BA at Heathrow so if it can happen there then it can happen anywhere.

I’ve regularly used the klm to jfk via AMS route and rarely if ever had an issue ( one was fogged out) so it’s just a turbulent time for all airlines at the mo.
 
Jedi boro said:
To be fair to klm and Teesside this is happening with BA at Heathrow so if it can happen there then it can happen anywhere.

I’ve regularly used the klm to jfk via AMS route and rarely if ever had an issue ( one was fogged out) so it’s just a turbulent time for all airlines at the mo.
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Then the subsidy should be coming from central government, not from local authorities.
 
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