Steve Gibson “pumps in £1m a month to keep the club afloat”

[atypical_boro]

its kind of immaterial as he’s here to stay, and owed too much money, and he’s done enough for the club that Id never be up for leading some kind of “Gibson out” charge. But the idea that one day he’ll just rediscover his genius I’m not sure is realistic. This is us now, until we either go bust, or do something so radical that it turns our fortunes around entirely.

The introduction of Scott may even be that, I’m willing to give it time, but we need whichever head coach we now bring in to get fully behind that too, which Wilder and Warnock clearly didn’t.

 

[Angus]

The club couldn't afford to pay interest on the debt HE has created. It would just make the existing debt to self even bigger.

He absolutely has not put that £120m in YET.
You raise a good point however, which there most certainly is an Opportunity Cost by him choosing to offset £120m of Bulkhaul asset with £120m of MFC liability (plus the Rockliffe vanity project).

GO'N could undoubtedly have done something much more productive with the £120m than propping up MFC. At least Mike O'Neill could.

I have highlighted which clubs are in worse positions than us re nett shareholder value.
Brighton are worst, but their debt is to Bloom as you say, a billionaire.
Stoke are next worse with 50% bigger nett negative value, but debt to the money making empire of Bet 365.
West Ham and Cardiff are the only 2 other clubs in a worse position.

Lots of people don't understand the finances and have a pop at those who do.
The Sheriff raises a key point, it is about competence, not just finance.

Your plan over the summer was to make Coventry accept a bid of at least £5 million pounds less than they wanted for a player Everton couldn’t afford.

You really are a annoying bore. You come on here and constantly criticise the man who effectively gives us a football club to support.

Your self proclaimed knowledge of football finances might help to inflate your own ego but just confirms to me what a hubristic bore you are.

 

[Nosmo-King]

Your plan over the summer was to make Coventry accept a bid of at least £5 million pounds less than they wanted for a player Everton couldn’t afford.

You really are a annoying bore. You come on here and constantly criticise the man who effectively gives us a football club to support.

Your self proclaimed knowledge of football finances might help to inflate your own ego but just confirms to me what a hubristic bore you are.

What rubbish! Indeedido offers an analysis after forensically examination of the clubs accounts. From this he deduces an opinion based on the facts he has gleaned. You and others are free to not accept the facts and his opinion.

However a lot on here appreciate his conclusions as working your way around balance sheets is not for everyone.

Criticise if this is your want - but be mindful he is the only one to offer a detailed insight into the wonderful world of MFC ACCOUNTS

 

[Angus]

What rubbish! Indeedido offers an analysis after forensically examination of the clubs accounts. From this he deduces an opinion based on the facts he has gleaned. You and others are free to not accept the facts and his opinion.

However a lot on here appreciate his conclusions as working your way around balance sheets is not for everyone.

Criticise if this is your want - but be mindful he is the only one to offer a detailed insight into the wonderful world of MFC ACCOUNTS

No he is someone who like many fans sits outside, criticises a man who has built himself from nothing and saved our club.


Anyone can criticise it is very easy to do, it’s much, much harder to actually do something. Steve Gibson has spent a fortune at the football club your pals analysis is that he should spend a fortune more but in the way he thinks appropriate!

What I find really annoying about him is that he makes it all sound so easy by saying things like just go and buy the best striker in the division as it is that easy. He appears not only to a consummate accountant but a footballing genius.



Liverpool a few years ago we’re in turmoil, Chelsea, were minutes from going to the wall, they were saved by Russian money. Manchester United have effectively been bought by a family without any money and now their fans are paying off their debt. Newcastle are owned by a sovereign wealth fund belonging to a vile regime.

Steve Gibson has made loads of mistakes, who hasn’t in life or business but thankfully he owns the club and I am sure will protect it as best he can.

 

[Quicksilvera]

No he is someone who like many fans sits outside, criticises a man who has built himself from nothing and saved our club.


Anyone can criticise it is very easy to do, it’s much, much harder to actually do something. Steve Gibson has spent a fortune at the football club your pals analysis is that he should spend a fortune more but in the way he thinks appropriate!

What I find really annoying about him is that he makes it all sound so easy by saying things like just go and buy the best striker in the division as it is that easy. He appears not only to a consummate accountant but a footballing genius.



Liverpool a few years ago we’re in turmoil, Chelsea, were minutes from going to the wall, they were saved by Russian money. Manchester United have effectively been bought by a family without any money and now their fans are paying off their debt. Newcastle are owned by a sovereign wealth fund belonging to a vile regime.

Steve Gibson has made loads of mistakes, who hasn’t in life or business but thankfully he owns the club and I am sure will protect it as best he can.

Totally agree with you, the poster in question is just reading what’s public knowledge which anybody can do and deduct from what’s in the document. Signing Gyokeres obviously wasn’t within our gift to do, we need to be promoted to sign players of that level. I also wouldn’t be against Gibson pocketing some of the money generated from sales but I highly doubt he has. If you look at our summer spending I believe it would have been very expensive so I highly doubt we could have paid £15-20m for anybody.

 

[Duffman]

PLEASE STOP BELIEVING THE HYPE. ITS RUBBISH. Gibson has written off in business terms far more than he has ever invested in MFC. His investment vs return on Boro is way in his benefit. It’s a myth , a Gibson induced legend that he kept us afloat. He is a hard nosed businessman- if it gives him a return he invests and if it doesn’t he writes it off. DON’T BELIEVE THE HYPE.

 

[Randy]

Why do people pick Brighton or Brentford to compare ourselves to? Why not look at some of our late 90s 00s premier League contemporaries?

Bolton. Coventry. Sheffield Wednesday. Charlton. Wimbledon. Derby County. Ipswich. Blackburn.

That's a good shout and arguably we are in a better position than all those you've listed.

Definitely in a better position by a country mile than Ipswich who've done nothing since been relegated from the championship, Bolton, who very nearly ceased to exist, Blackburn who were stiffed by the Venkys chicken people, Derby, who we all know what happened there and Coventry who had stadium issues.

That said, I think the time has come for Gibson to look for some outside investment. Granted that's what most clubs are looking for in similar positions to ourselves. Without it I fear we could do a Sunderland and flounce around League One for a few years which will decimate the value of the club as a whole and make it even harder to get out of that league given the other clubs in that league who are sleeping Championship giants.

 

[HolgateCorner]

Not many supporters of any club are totally happy with their ownership.

Some of the wealthiest are owned by complete crooks or, sadly in the case of Newcastle, a murderous regime.

It‘s an oddity of football that the average fan has no say whatsoever in who owns the club, who the manager is and what players are picked for the team.

The supporter is emotionally invested and hands over hard earned money to watch week in week out on nothing more than hoping somebody rich enough will come along at some point to transform the fortunes of the club.

And apart from sound off on here or boo in the stadium if you are so inclined, that’s all you can do, travel hopefully, it really isn’t worth worrying about.

 

[indeedido]

Your plan over the summer was to make Coventry accept a bid of at least £5 million pounds less than they wanted for a player Everton couldn’t afford.

You really are a annoying bore. You come on here and constantly criticise the man who effectively gives us a football club to support.

Your self proclaimed knowledge of football finances might help to inflate your own ego but just confirms to me what a hubristic bore you are.

It really is easy Angus, just put me on ignore.
I hoped as a fan that the club would sign one or two players of the class of Gyokeres, given it had the financial means to do so given the profit from Spence and Tavernier. This for the first time since the Monk/pulis awful spending.

Why do you resent somebody putting facts forward and also expressing opinions?
You have your opinion that Gibson should be revered, that he must not be criticised, that we owe our existence as a club to him and that we could not have a future without him.
I think you are blinkered and completely wrong.

I do have a pretty good grasp of the finance football clubs and have looked at all the clubs in the top two leagues, plus another few league one clubs. I have only used what is available through Companies House.
My opinions on who should be manager, who should be in the team, why we got beat, what shirt we should wear, who we should sign are no more informed or valid than any other fan who goes along.
On the finances, I do have enough knowledge to analyse the reports in the public domain. I can make informed observations and encourage people to think, to challenge.
People like you Angus don’t like that. You like everyone to know their place and to keep their heads in the sand.
If I wind you up, challenge me on what I post. What have I posted re the finances is wrong?

 

[Kelloe]

Your plan over the summer was to make Coventry accept a bid of at least £5 million pounds less than they wanted for a player Everton couldn’t afford.

You really are a annoying bore. You come on here and constantly criticise the man who effectively gives us a football club to support.

Your self proclaimed knowledge of football finances might help to inflate your own ego but just confirms to me what a hubristic bore you are.

 

[Angus]

It really is easy Angus, just put me on ignore.
I hoped as a fan that the club would sign one or two players of the class of Gyokeres, given it had the financial means to do so given the profit from Spence and Tavernier. This for the first time since the Monk/pulis awful spending.

Why do you resent somebody putting facts forward and also expressing opinions?
You have your opinion that Gibson should be revered, that he must not be criticised, that we owe our existence as a club to him and that we could not have a future without him.
I think you are blinkered and completely wrong.

I do have a pretty good grasp of the finance football clubs and have looked at all the clubs in the top two leagues, plus another few league one clubs. I have only used what is available through Companies House.
My opinions on who should be manager, who should be in the team, why we got beat, what shirt we should wear, who we should sign are no more informed or valid than any other fan who goes along.
On the finances, I do have enough knowledge to analyse the reports in the public domain. I can make informed observations and encourage people to think, to challenge.
People like you Angus don’t like that. You like everyone to know their place and to keep their heads in the sand.
If I wind you up, challenge me on what I post. What have I posted re the finances is wrong?

Hopefully your financial skills are better than your comprehension skills.

I make clear that Gibson has made mistakes and is not without criticism.

My problem with you is you make it all sound so easy, you don’t give the chairmen the credit for the difficult job that he has to do.

In our conversation earlier in the season you said that Coventry would probably settle for around about £10 million it’s “informed speculation” that winds me up.

You think you have an insight you have nothing. You might know something about accounts but running a football club, dealing with all the issues that surround a football club is probably a lot more involved than a little number crunching .

 

[JM14]

Your plan over the summer was to make Coventry accept a bid of at least £5 million pounds less than they wanted for a player Everton couldn’t afford.

You really are a annoying bore. You come on here and constantly criticise the man who effectively gives us a football club to support.

Your self proclaimed knowledge of football finances might help to inflate your own ego but just confirms to me what a hubristic bore you are.

Basically you don’t like what’s being said, you can’t think of any response to counter what was said, so have just sent a load of personal abuse instead.

At least say why the post is wrong if you don’t agree with it without resorting to that rubbish

 

[JM14]

My problem with you is you make it all sound so easy, you don’t give the chairmen the credit for the difficult job that he has to do.

just out of interest what credit should we give Gibson for anything he has done in the last decade?

 

[Angus]

just out of interest what credit should we give Gibson for anything he has done in the last decade?

I have never said that Steve Gibson has not made mistakes as chairmen, he clearly has.


My issue with the poster in question is that it is very easy to criticise people that actually do things and his solutions are naively simplistic.



The posters solution to our poor football performance at the moment is that the chairmen should spend more of his money and thereby possibly increase the debt that he is owed and also just buy the best players irrespective of what they cost.

Credit to the chairmen I think is due for continuing to support the club which is a financial drain on his business, at the same time as running that multi million pound business in challenging times.

 

[indeedido]

Hopefully your financial skills are better than your comprehension skills.

I make clear that Gibson has made mistakes and is not without criticism.

My problem with you is you make it all sound so easy, you don’t give the chairmen the credit for the difficult job that he has to do.

In our conversation earlier in the season you said that Coventry would probably settle for around about £10 million it’s “informed speculation” that winds me up.

You think you have an insight you have nothing. You might know something about accounts but running a football club, dealing with all the issues that surround a football club is probably a lot more involved than a little number crunching .

I suggested Gyokeres was worth £15m and said If a PL club came in we had no chance.
I said we had no idea what was actually bid for him, or what Cov would actually accept.
I said that £15m - if we had to pay it - was £3m per season amortisation over a 5 year contract and £9m across the next 3 years of FFP. Given the profit from sales, I said this year of all years we could afford him. That’s what I actually said.
I also gave Gibson credit by saying I thought he had managed through Covid well and cleared the decks of rubbish and thought (opinion) he would use the transfer profit to have a go.
He didn’t.

Listen to yourself. “You think you have insight, you have nothing”. I do have some insight and I express my opinion. I have never posted my opinion as fact.
I don’t make anything “sound so easy”, but I do challenge.
I will continue to do so.

 

[Quicksilvera]

I suggested Gyokeres was worth £15m and said If a PL club came in we had no chance.
I said we had no idea what was actually bid for him, or what Cov would actually accept.
I said that £15m - if we had to pay it - was £3m per season amortisation over a 5 year contract and £9m across the next 3 years of FFP. Given the profit from sales, I said this year of all years we could afford him. That’s what I actually said.
I also gave Gibson credit by saying I thought he had managed through Covid well and cleared the decks of rubbish and thought (opinion) he would use the transfer profit to have a go.
He didn’t.

Listen to yourself. “You think you have insight, you have nothing”. I do have some insight and I express my opinion. I have never posted my opinion as fact.
I don’t make anything “sound so easy”, but I do challenge.
I will continue to do so.

This isn’t insight it’s basic football finance, most can work out amortisation of transfer fees but it isn’t just transfer fees there’s wages, agents fees, bonuses etc. We don’t know how much we’ve paid out for the loans this season I bet they weren’t cheap, especially Steffen. In your earlier claim that wilder wasn’t backed by Gibson is total ballcocks really isn’t it.

 

[indeedido]

I have never said that Steve Gibson has not made mistakes as chairmen, he clearly has.


My issue with the poster in question is that it is very easy to criticise people that actually do things and his solutions are naively simplistic.



The posters solution to our poor football performance at the moment is that the chairmen should spend more of his money and thereby possibly increase the debt that he is owed and also just buy the best players irrespective of what they cost.

Credit to the chairmen I think is due for continuing to support the club which is a financial drain on his business, at the same time as running that multi million pound business in challenging times.

Again what I actually said was the only chance Gibson had of stopping the spiral of losses he was in was to get promoted; that this season represented his best chance of doing so given the wage bill was down, amortisation cut, revenue increased and a huge transfer profit on two players with no book value; plus having an experienced manager aligned and renewed crowd engagement.
I said we were in good FFP shape and that he could at last spend and recruit quality after what must have been a very frustrating period.
Tell me where I have said we should go out and just buy the best players irrespective of cost. I have clearly said we would obviously still need to recruit wisely, find good cheaper players, use loans and be open to frees. All I dared say was we can now afford to sign some real quality and pay some fees as the 2 big sales partly bridged the gap to Parachute payment clubs.
As I have said Angus, put me on ignore.

If Rob thinks I am posting unreasonably he will no doubt ban me.
This is a message board for opinions and challenge.
I can live with your insults Angus, I’m not bothered.

 

[Angus]

You said we should buy Gyokeres and suggested that Coventry would probably take substantially less than the minimum figure that was associated with him.

I don’t want to put you on ignore I am not so arrogant to think that I shouldn’t listen to other’s opinions and if need be apologise if it turns out what they were saying is valid.

I don’t think anyone has suggested you should be banned.

 

[JM14]

I have never said that Steve Gibson has not made mistakes as chairmen, he clearly has.


My issue with the poster in question is that it is very easy to criticise people that actually do things and his solutions are naively simplistic.



The posters solution to our poor football performance at the moment is that the chairmen should spend more of his money and thereby possibly increase the debt that he is owed and also just buy the best players irrespective of what they cost.

Credit to the chairmen I think is due for continuing to support the club which is a financial drain on his business, at the same time as running that multi million pound business in challenging times.

I haven’t seen a single person saying we should be buying players irrespective of cost on here. Are we right to question why we lost our best player in Tav for decent money and only replaced him with Mowatt on loan this summer though? Or why we spent the summer buying players the man he brought in as manager clearly didn’t want? I would think they are all fairly realistic things to ask considering the position the clubs now in.
How about why the club is going through a different manager every season? Or why the club is seemingly skint despite being in the premier league just a few years ago years ago and bringing in about 25 million this summer? Why we have to have a complete overhaul of our squad every season? Why as fans we are paying one of the highest prices in the league to watch our side?

I don’t think any of this is credit to the owner personally do you? All I see is my team slowly getting worse every season and currently in one of the most desperate situations we have been in for a long time with seemingly zero answers to the fans who turn up every week. I don’t really care what Gibson did 30 years ago I just want the club to be able to compete and under this ownership it is doing anything but

 

[indeedido]

This isn’t insight it’s basic football finance, most can work out amortisation of transfer fees but it isn’t just transfer fees there’s wages, agents fees, bonuses etc. We don’t know how much we’ve paid out for the loans this season I bet they weren’t cheap, especially Steffen. In your earlier claim that wilder wasn’t backed by Gibson is total ballcocks really isn’t it.

The insight I have is not the Gyokeres opinion I posted and was correcting Angus on.
Gibson will post at least £22.5m profit in this years books from the sale of Spence and Tav.
The new amortisation charge on the summer dealings will struggle to be above £2m this season, based on £7.75m outlay.
The loans don’t have to be itemised in the Accounts, but their cost does have to be included, as was Bolasie et al in the year to June 2021 and Sporar, Connolly et al in the unpublished accounts to June 2022.
The costs are real. Nobody is saying that Muniz, Giles, Steffen and Mowatt are free, but they do pretty much cycle the fact we had costs for the 4 loan players of last season.
There was a lot more scope this season to sign quality than we have had for years.
We didn’t, are in the bottom three and without a manager.