Performance vs Wage Spend

Left_peg

Left_peg

Well-known member
1. Leeds United – £40,768,000 Position 1st
Performance +/- 0
2. Burnley – £37,160,000 Position 2nd
Performance +/- 0
3. Sheff United – £21,450,000 Position 3rd
Performance +/- 0
4. Luton Town – £20,015,000 Position 20th
Performance -16
5. Norwich City – £17,850,000 Position 11th
Performance -6
6. West Brom – £17,160,000 Position 6th
Performance +/- 0
7. Cardiff City – £15,132,000 Position 23rd
Performance -16
8. Watford – £12,242,000 Position 9th
Performance -1
9. Middlesbrough – £10,704,000 Position 5th
Performance +4
10. Stoke City – £10,588,000 Position 19th
Performance -9
11. Bristol City – £10,204,000 Position 8th
Performance +3
12. QPR – £10,138,000 Position 16th
Performance -4
13. Swansea – £10,000,000 Position 12th
Performance +1
14. Coventry City – £9,762,000 Position 15th
Performance -1
15. Sheffield Wed – £9,254,000 Position 10th
Performance +5
16. Blackburn – £9,222,000 Position 7th
Performance +9
17. Preston – £8,849,000 Position 14th
Performance +3
18. Hull City – £8,774,000 Position 22nd
Performance -4
19. Sunderland – £8,582,000 Position 4th
Performance +15
20. Millwall – £9,708,000 Position 13th
Performance +7
21. Plymouth – £6,192,000 Position 24th
Performance -3
22. Derby County – £5,156,000 Position 18th
Performance +4
23. Portsmouth – £4,412,000 Position 21st
Performance +2
24. Oxford – £3,537,000 Position 17th
Performance +7

Carrick currently has us outperforming our wage spend by 4 places. Top 3 spending way more than anyone else except Luton who are an absolute car crash this season. Got to give Sunderland credit, easily the highest over-performance
 
Is this the next defence?

We've moved on from xg and xa, injuries and players making individual mistakes, now it's all fine as we're outperforming our wage budget FFS

Despite the fact that Sunderland are massively outperforming theirs.

Obviously the recent PL teams have bigger wage bills, is this new info?

It's funny it is a defence now, despite us being at the top of the wage charts in the past and still being unable to get promoted.

Just more clutching at straws to defend our indefensible home form and performances against dross IMO.

We should be beating more teams, especially when we have a lead.
 
How is it a defense, I think it’s just an interesting fact…

Didn’t adi-dem bang on about this years ago…

All these stats are just that, stats… the only ones that count are results and points…
 
Caesium137 said:
Is this the next defence?

We've moved on from xg and xa, injuries and players making individual mistakes, now it's all fine as we're outperforming our wage budget FFS

Despite the fact that Sunderland are massively outperforming theirs.

Obviously the recent PL teams have bigger wage bills, is this new info?

It's funny it is a defence now, despite us being at the top of the wage charts in the past and still being unable to get promoted.

Just more clutching at straws to defend our indefensible home form and performances against dross IMO.

We should be beating more teams, especially when we have a lead.
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It's perfectly reasonable to think that a team with a 40mill wage budget will probably finish above a team with a 10 mill wage budget.

When's the last time we had the biggest or one of the biggest budgets? Probably when Monk was here. Carrick has been easily our best performing manager since the karanka promotion season it's not up for debate.
 
It's completely made up numbers though so it's pretty much useless. I don't believe Cardiff's wage bill is 50% higher than ours and I don't think ours is only £10m (it's probably double that).
 
Left_peg said:
1. Leeds United – £40,768,000 Position 1st
Performance +/- 0
2. Burnley – £37,160,000 Position 2nd
Performance +/- 0
3. Sheff United – £21,450,000 Position 3rd
Performance +/- 0
4. Luton Town – £20,015,000 Position 20th
Performance -16
5. Norwich City – £17,850,000 Position 11th
Performance -6
6. West Brom – £17,160,000 Position 6th
Performance +/- 0
7. Cardiff City – £15,132,000 Position 23rd
Performance -16
8. Watford – £12,242,000 Position 9th
Performance -1
9. Middlesbrough – £10,704,000 Position 5th
Performance +4
10. Stoke City – £10,588,000 Position 19th
Performance -9
11. Bristol City – £10,204,000 Position 8th
Performance +3
12. QPR – £10,138,000 Position 16th
Performance -4
13. Swansea – £10,000,000 Position 12th
Performance +1
14. Coventry City – £9,762,000 Position 15th
Performance -1
15. Sheffield Wed – £9,254,000 Position 10th
Performance +5
16. Blackburn – £9,222,000 Position 7th
Performance +9
17. Preston – £8,849,000 Position 14th
Performance +3
18. Hull City – £8,774,000 Position 22nd
Performance -4
19. Sunderland – £8,582,000 Position 4th
Performance +15
20. Millwall – £9,708,000 Position 13th
Performance +7
21. Plymouth – £6,192,000 Position 24th
Performance -3
22. Derby County – £5,156,000 Position 18th
Performance +4
23. Portsmouth – £4,412,000 Position 21st
Performance +2
24. Oxford – £3,537,000 Position 17th
Performance +7

Carrick currently has us outperforming our wage spend by 4 places. Top 3 spending way more than anyone else except Luton who are an absolute car crash this season. Got to give Sunderland credit, easily the highest over-performance
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When you consider we’ve had smith, Lenihan, Forss and bangura all injured all season that must be about 1.5m of our budget actually unavailable which puts us closer to Sheff we’d level of wages and about +10 performance
 
Caesium137 said:
Obviously the recent PL teams have bigger wage bills, is this new info?
Click to expand...
They are, if they don’t muck it up three of them should go straight back up, Luton have mucked it up, but Leeds have stepped up. Realistically 4th was the best we could get without them making a pigs ear of it, we could still finish 4th but more realistically 5-8th which is about aligned to our budget
 
xxlshirts_fit_all said:
How is it a defense, I think it’s just an interesting fact…

Didn’t adi-dem bang on about this years ago…

All these stats are just that, stats… the only ones that count are results and points…
Click to expand...
It was Boksic. The theory is pretty well explained in the book “Soccernomics” which is a great read. The theory is not supposed to be 100% accurate, more like 90% accurate, so there will always be obvious examples of teams performing above or below their station.

In reality, the best we could have hoped for this season (regardless of what “vibes” Carrick and Scott gave off pre-season) was probably 4th. And we’re 5th at present.

If we finish 5th or 6th, it will be only the 5th time we’ve finished in the top 6 since relegation 16 years ago.
 
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Another good way to understand expectations is what you think the customer should pay.

I wonder where we should be in the league given what our customers are charged.

But, it’s all a bit daft and hindsighty (if that’s a word)

At the start of the season most of us would have been reasonably happy being where we are now.
There is more context (😉) given what we have seen though.

We have thrown away so many points at home plus the likes of Norwich, Derby and Watford away.
It’s easy to make a case that we could have an extra 10 points or so.

I think that is what people look at rather than stats
 
Corcaigh_the_Cat said:
Am I?
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Don’t think so - just failed to hit the right note with the wording.
It goes down as a fail on my part

We often get posts saying ‘Sunderland fans are obsessed with us’

In answer to your question
On the best metric points and performances…. Rather well
 
We've spent more than a few quid on signings / wages etc. Carrick has been very well backed and the minimum we should achieve is the top 6.

The stats shouldn't distract from the fact we should be beating the likes of Plymouth and Cardiff. Also failing to beat Sheffield Wednesday at home when 3-0 up at HT.

Infact it would have been a disastrous Xmas period had we not scored a 93rd min winner at Hull. It was an easy run of fixtures.

I heard Barlaser say we are unbeaten in 6. That's very glass half full. We've thrown away points against sides we should be beating on our budget and wages.
 
Left_peg said:
1. Leeds United – £40,768,000 Position 1st
Performance +/- 0
2. Burnley – £37,160,000 Position 2nd
Performance +/- 0
3. Sheff United – £21,450,000 Position 3rd
Performance +/- 0
4. Luton Town – £20,015,000 Position 20th
Performance -16
5. Norwich City – £17,850,000 Position 11th
Performance -6
6. West Brom – £17,160,000 Position 6th
Performance +/- 0
7. Cardiff City – £15,132,000 Position 23rd
Performance -16
8. Watford – £12,242,000 Position 9th
Performance -1
9. Middlesbrough – £10,704,000 Position 5th
Performance +4
10. Stoke City – £10,588,000 Position 19th
Performance -9
11. Bristol City – £10,204,000 Position 8th
Performance +3
12. QPR – £10,138,000 Position 16th
Performance -4
13. Swansea – £10,000,000 Position 12th
Performance +1
14. Coventry City – £9,762,000 Position 15th
Performance -1
15. Sheffield Wed – £9,254,000 Position 10th
Performance +5
16. Blackburn – £9,222,000 Position 7th
Performance +9
17. Preston – £8,849,000 Position 14th
Performance +3
18. Hull City – £8,774,000 Position 22nd
Performance -4
19. Sunderland – £8,582,000 Position 4th
Performance +15
20. Millwall – £9,708,000 Position 13th
Performance +7
21. Plymouth – £6,192,000 Position 24th
Performance -3
22. Derby County – £5,156,000 Position 18th
Performance +4
23. Portsmouth – £4,412,000 Position 21st
Performance +2
24. Oxford – £3,537,000 Position 17th
Performance +7

Carrick currently has us outperforming our wage spend by 4 places. Top 3 spending way more than anyone else except Luton who are an absolute car crash this season. Got to give Sunderland credit, easily the highest over-performance
Click to expand...
You are largely wasting your time. One thing the Carrick Out brigade and moaners have in common is they don't trust data.

They believe we have a top 2 squad and no amount of evidence to the contrary will sway them.

The first result mentions xg. The data analysts and thinkers amongst the group pointed that out in early season when we weren't getting our just rewards for our play. We by and large do now, that's why we have gone from mid table to 5th and why we don't use it.

Those of us clever enough, or at least un emotional enough to look at the situation with some objectivity know we are about where we should be. I would suggest that we are currently performing quite well with what Carrick has to play with. We have a deleted, tired squad where many of them are playing with niggles because we don't have a fit alternative.

The posts that sum up the moaners are the posts about hackney being rubbish this season. There's is no balance, no objectivity and no data to back up that opinion, yet we see post after post saying just that.
 
So really, as with most things, the truth is somewhere in between the extreme views of some on here.

Are we doing reasonably well considering our investment relative to others - yes

Have we thrown points away so far this season - yes

Is our home form disappointing - yes

Is our away form pleasing - yes

Could we be doing better - yes

Could we be doing worse - yes

Should we sack Carrick - absolutely F***ing not
 
How is Cardiff's wage bill higher than our's? Their squad is basically just domestic no-names
 
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