Never offside!

The Card Cheat said:
Is it worth it though?
The utter delirium of celebrating a vital goal, like Hackneys against Chelsea, knowing that nothing, literally nothing in the world can take that Goal away once the ref gives it, imagine that gone forever.
Imagine the tedium of up to 8 minute reviews to see if a goal is one inch offside.
Imagine the injustice of having VAR and still being on the end of horrendous decisions.
Imagine players going down in the box after the tiniest of touches because they know VAR will give penalties on technicalities.

Don't forget there's times we've benefitted by dodgy decisions this season too, Jones opener against Cardiff was clearly offside and there was a foul by our player before our first goal against Norwich.
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Yeah, I get the argument but on balance I'd rather have the big decisions right.
 
festa5 said:
Never mind VAR. I'd say it distracts from the bigger issue, and this is something highlighted by VAR, that is the capability and decision making of referees.

They're fully professional now, well paid, but they often seem no more capable than when they were part time.

Human error is always going to occur, if they don't see something, then fair enough. But a lot of the time they do see things, or when VAR is used, see things several times, and still make decisions that seem baffling to everyone else.

They're in denial if they don't think there's a lot of scope for improvement. I'd say they need a top down review of how refs are trained, do ongoing development and are assessed because their level is currently nowhere near good enough given the resources now available.

And don't get me started on the level of fitness of some of them. Those minimum standards are nowhere near high enough for the pace of the modern game.
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“Fitness”?
You're right.
Some look like they've spent the night in the Navi and just rolled out the doss bag (n)
 
Just feels like we've been really unlucky this season with injuries and decisions. Hopefully saving our luck for a charge at the end of the season.
 
Jedi boro said:
No such thing as luck with officials and they don’t even themselves out either.
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But they do though, we just conveniently forget the favourable ones we get.
We scored 3 goals in about 5 games that were blatantly offside earlier in the season against WBA, Cardiff and Sunderland. We scored against Norwich after a foul by Jones. We benefitted by having a ref who was extremely strict in sending off the Sunderland player. That's just off the top of my head and I'm extremely biased towards Boro.
Officials generally are just gadgies doing their best, not machines.
 
The Card Cheat said:
But they do though, we just conveniently forget the favourable ones we get.
We scored 3 goals in about 5 games that were blatantly offside earlier in the season against WBA, Cardiff and Sunderland. We scored against Norwich after a foul by Jones. We benefitted by having a ref who was extremely strict in sending off the Sunderland player. That's just off the top of my head and I'm extremely biased towards Boro.
Officials generally are just gadgies doing their best, not machines.
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Which is exactly why they should be given more help if it is available (via VAR) and far more training. What other industry would accept gadgies doing their best being responsible for £100m+ prizes?
 
sadgit said:
I would rather human error than VAR
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Agree. I can live with occasional errors that cost a win if it means no VAR.

As for accountability and explanation, what do you expect?

Is the linesman come out and say anything other than "I gave it because it looked offside to me"? Do we really need to hear that?

As for punishment, he's officiating at league 2 level next week. That means theres a vacancy at championship level next week. It's going to be filled by a league 1 linesman who, thus far, has been inferior to the guy who has been demoted. Where is the winner in that.

Maybe a spell in the stocks for the linesman would be a more rational response?
 
Nano said:
Which is exactly why they should be given more help if it is available (via VAR) and far more training. What other industry would accept gadgies doing their best being responsible for £100m+ prizes?
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At the end of the day every industry is just some gadgies doing their best. Some dress is up a bit more mind.
 
Frozen Horse said:
Agree. I can live with occasional errors that cost a win if it means no VAR.

As for accountability and explanation, what do you expect?

Is the linesman come out and say anything other than "I gave it because it looked offside to me"? Do we really need to hear that?

As for punishment, he's officiating at league 2 level next week. That means theres a vacancy at championship level next week. It's going to be filled by a league 1 linesman who, thus far, has been inferior to the guy who has been demoted. Where is the winner in that.

Maybe a spell in the stocks for the linesman would be a more rational response?
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Happy with the stocks as long as they are in the car park for an hour after the match and we can throw wet sponges at them, a bit of public humiliation would do them the world of good.
 
Philly-Red said:
Nobody expects perfection but 3 key decisions in 2 games v Rotherham and we’ve been cost 5 points because of it. The ref also let Hugill off with assaulting Jones. Why? He didn’t miss it. It wasn’t an attempt to play the ball.

It isn’t good enough.
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We had players make more mistakes than that which cost us this game. Watch Clarke's involvement in their goal and the two headers he missed. I agree Hugill should have been booked for his push but you can't blame the linesman for getting the Coburn/Crooks decision wrong. It is hard enough to see if he's offside from the replays and it took a still picture to prove he wasn't, something the linesman never had the benefit of seeing.
 
Norman_Conquest said:
We had players make more mistakes than that which cost us this game. Watch Clarke's involvement in their goal and the two headers he missed. I agree Hugill should have been booked for his push but you can't blame the linesman for getting the Coburn/Crooks decision wrong. It is hard enough to see if he's offside from the replays and it took a still picture to prove he wasn't, something the linesman never had the benefit of seeing.
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I think we need to separate blaming our players for the ref and linesman getting it wrong.

This line of comment appears after every match when we have been robbed.

We are playing teams who are at the same level as us. The games are going to be tight and decided on fine margins, that is why it is a competitive league spectators want to pay good money to watch.

The performance of the referees both good and bad really does make a difference to the outcome.
 
HolgateCorner said:
I think we need to separate blaming our players for the ref and linesman getting it wrong.

This line of comment appears after every match when we have been robbed.

We are playing teams who are at the same level as us. The games are going to be tight and decided on fine margins, that is why it is a competitive league spectators want to pay good money to watch.

The performance of the referees both good and bad really does make a difference to the outcome.
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I'm not blaming anyone, I am showing we all make mistakes.

Unfortunately, the standard of refereeing is dropping and it is hard to get people to take up the whistle. Understandable when you see what's been posted on here.
 
HolgateCorner said:
The performance of the referees both good and bad really does make a difference to the outcome.
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That’s is the most ludicrous thing I’ve ever seen on here so a bad ref can’t influence a game.

No pen - influenced a game
Allowing an offside goal to stand yep I’d say that had an impact
Disallowing a goal at the death in injury time depriving us of 3 pts.

But yes apart from that he made no difference to the game

🫤
 
festa5 said:
Never mind VAR. I'd say it distracts from the bigger issue, and this is something highlighted by VAR, that is the capability and decision making of referees.

They're fully professional now, well paid, but they often seem no more capable than when they were part time.

Human error is always going to occur, if they don't see something, then fair enough. But a lot of the time they do see things, or when VAR is used, see things several times, and still make decisions that seem baffling to everyone else.

They're in denial if they don't think there's a lot of scope for improvement. I'd say they need a top down review of how refs are trained, do ongoing development and are assessed because their level is currently nowhere near good enough given the resources now available.

And don't get me started on the level of fitness of some of them. Those minimum standards are nowhere near high enough for the pace of the modern game.
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I think the fitness issue might be the major factor in refs getting so many wrong. They are professional, there is absolutely no excuse for them being fat like the one yesterday.

If they can't be professional enough to be in shape then how can we trust them to understand the rules? Also if they are so unfit then they will make poor decisions due to blowing out of their ars* and not having enough oxygen to the brain.
 
sadgit said:
I would rather human error than VAR
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Exactly this. The fact that you are not happy with the outcome yesterday does not mean that you would accept or welcome the hideous assault on the nature of the game that the abomination of VAR is.

We can't change the result yesterday not matter how much we rail against the ineptitude of that particular group of officials but I do not want my matchday experience to be ruined by VAR thank you very much. I'm all in favour of technological aids to referees where they are instantaneous (so if there was a way that a lino could get an AI assisted offside decision in real time I would absolutely welcome it but five minutes of confusion whilst unseen and unquestionable anonymous officials draw lines on telly screens is not a way to adjudicate anything let alone a football match)
 
Norman_Conquest said:
I'm not blaming anyone, I am showing we all make mistakes.

Unfortunately, the standard of refereeing is dropping and it is hard to get people to take up the whistle. Understandable when you see what's been posted on here.
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Yes that’s true it’s a tough role but we have to face reality that the reffing really is not up to the required standard.

It needs a complete overhaul of standards and fitness with proper use of the modern technology.

Its the only part of football which has not been modernised in the last 30 years.

Player training and fitness, stadium facilities, team tactics, managerial and coaching structures, nutrition and medical, overseas players and coaches etc etc.

Everything has changed and moved forward….except the refereeing.

It’s time to make it better, much better.
 
Muttley said:
The fact that you are not happy with the outcome yesterday does not mean that you would accept or welcome the hideous assault on the nature of the game that the abomination of VAR
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I would I’d have it tomorrow

With VAR we’d be at least 5 if not more places higher as these are obvious “errors” I’m seeing players cleaned out with nothing given. Goals scored ruled out incorrectly.
 
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