Mental health advice needed

anth25

anth25

Well-known member
Appreciate that there are probably better places to be asking this question but I've always seen responses to other posts on here be discussed in a compassionate and helpful manner so thought I'd ask.

My best mate of the last 30yrs is really struggling at the moment and I'm at a loss with what to do.

I'll try and keep the backstory as brief as possible. He's 43yo and around 6yrs ago split up with his wife who he had 2-kids with. One is now 12 and the other is 10. He's a great dad to them and wants to be totally 50/50 in the care side of things. He managed to get an agreement in place for 50/50 share however after a couple of months his ex realised this would have a massive impact on maintenance and so has started making it difficult and saying that the kids don't want to stay with him as much as with her. One of the reasons she gives is that they don't like the 40min journey home from school every night. The reason for this is that after a couple of years separated he met someone else and moved to Manchester, around 1hr 20min from where they live. He then ended up having a kid with this new partner and got married earlier this year. His new wife agreed to move closer to where his ex lives (and the kids go to school) but didn't want to move back to the town where they are. So they picked Chester as a mid ground which is around 40mins away.

He has now got the the stage where he is struggling to keep his two kids happy and see them as much as he likes while also trying to build a marriage and family with his new wife and kid. The fact that she won't move back to the Wirral is now becoming a massive issue and they are falling out over it big time to the point where he is now talking about getting a small place on the Wirral for himself. He is only 6-mths into his new marriage but I can see that he is hitting the self destruct button with it. He can't see what he has got with his new wife and he can't see any of the positives in his life. He only ever focuses on the negatives and has such a "woe is me" mentality. The guilt that he feels for not being with his 2 kids all the time is weighing so heavily on him but to the point that it is massively clouding his judgement and decision making. He is going to end up with another failed marriage and things will be even worse for him.

I have tried talking to him, pointing out the positives in his life and reassuring him that he is not failing his kids. Despite only seeing them 50/50 he is probably more present than most Dad's that live at home full time. However he won't listen to me. Despite us being best mates he has this huge chip on his shoulder about me. He had a difficult upbringing with an alcoholic Dad and no wider family to support him. I had the opposite and am still surrounded by a loving family who I can fall back on. He doesn't and over the years I have been the closest thing he has to family. But I'm starting to feel really helpless and all I get back from him is "you wouldn't understand", "you don't know how tough I had it" "you've had it easy all your life". For context he grew up in Eaglescliffe, had a great mum, went away to uni, has a good job and a 4-bed house in Chester (I know that isn't important when it comes to MH, I'm just trying to give a bit of context to his "hard luck story")

I probably sound a bit callous in the way I'm talking about him and I'm certainly not trying to trivialise the fact that he is obviously really struggling. But I just don't know what to do. I've tried to get him to talk to someone but he isn't having it. Doesn't think it will help.

Was genuinely thinking of just booking and paying for some sessions for him and giving him the ultimatum that he either goes and sees someone or me and him are done. Don't want to turn my back on him but I don't know whether some tough love is needed. In the past I think I've been guilty of just pandering to him and going along with him rather than telling him what I really think. For example when he said he was moving to Manchester I really didn't think it was a good idea because of his kids. I should probably have said something at the time, not that he would have listened.

Well done and thanks if you managed to get this far!!! If anyone has any ideas on what I can do to help I would appreciate it. Don't know where to turn and it's really playing on my mind.
 
anth25 said:
Appreciate that there are probably better places to be asking this question but I've always seen responses to other posts on here be discussed in a compassionate and helpful manner so thought I'd ask.

My best mate of the last 30yrs is really struggling at the moment and I'm at a loss with what to do.

I'll try and keep the backstory as brief as possible. He's 43yo and around 6yrs ago split up with his wife who he had 2-kids with. One is now 12 and the other is 10. He's a great dad to them and wants to be totally 50/50 in the care side of things. He managed to get an agreement in place for 50/50 share however after a couple of months his ex realised this would have a massive impact on maintenance and so has started making it difficult and saying that the kids don't want to stay with him as much as with her. One of the reasons she gives is that they don't like the 40min journey home from school every night. The reason for this is that after a couple of years separated he met someone else and moved to Manchester, around 1hr 20min from where they live. He then ended up having a kid with this new partner and got married earlier this year. His new wife agreed to move closer to where his ex lives (and the kids go to school) but didn't want to move back to the town where they are. So they picked Chester as a mid ground which is around 40mins away.

He has now got the the stage where he is struggling to keep his two kids happy and see them as much as he likes while also trying to build a marriage and family with his new wife and kid. The fact that she won't move back to the Wirral is now becoming a massive issue and they are falling out over it big time to the point where he is now talking about getting a small place on the Wirral for himself. He is only 6-mths into his new marriage but I can see that he is hitting the self destruct button with it. He can't see what he has got with his new wife and he can't see any of the positives in his life. He only ever focuses on the negatives and has such a "woe is me" mentality. The guilt that he feels for not being with his 2 kids all the time is weighing so heavily on him but to the point that it is massively clouding his judgement and decision making. He is going to end up with another failed marriage and things will be even worse for him.

I have tried talking to him, pointing out the positives in his life and reassuring him that he is not failing his kids. Despite only seeing them 50/50 he is probably more present than most Dad's that live at home full time. However he won't listen to me. Despite us being best mates he has this huge chip on his shoulder about me. He had a difficult upbringing with an alcoholic Dad and no wider family to support him. I had the opposite and am still surrounded by a loving family who I can fall back on. He doesn't and over the years I have been the closest thing he has to family. But I'm starting to feel really helpless and all I get back from him is "you wouldn't understand", "you don't know how tough I had it" "you've had it easy all your life". For context he grew up in Eaglescliffe, had a great mum, went away to uni, has a good job and a 4-bed house in Chester (I know that isn't important when it comes to MH, I'm just trying to give a bit of context to his "hard luck story")

I probably sound a bit callous in the way I'm talking about him and I'm certainly not trying to trivialise the fact that he is obviously really struggling. But I just don't know what to do. I've tried to get him to talk to someone but he isn't having it. Doesn't think it will help.

Was genuinely thinking of just booking and paying for some sessions for him and giving him the ultimatum that he either goes and sees someone or me and him are done. Don't want to turn my back on him but I don't know whether some tough love is needed. In the past I think I've been guilty of just pandering to him and going along with him rather than telling him what I really think. For example when he said he was moving to Manchester I really didn't think it was a good idea because of his kids. I should probably have said something at the time, not that he would have listened.

Well done and thanks if you managed to get this far!!! If anyone has any ideas on what I can do to help I would appreciate it. Don't know where to turn and it's really playing on my mind.
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"I've tried to get him to talk to someone but he isn't having it. Doesn't think it will help."

That's all you can do mate. Don't be giving ultimatums. IMHO. Just wait until he wants you next.
 
atypical_boro said:
"I've tried to get him to talk to someone but he isn't having it. Doesn't think it will help."

That's all you can do mate. Don't be giving ultimatums. IMHO. Just wait until he wants you next.
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Thanks for taking the time to reply.
My worry with waiting and not doing anything is;
1. He does something daft. I don't think he is in this position and I think his kids mean too much to him but how do you ever know. However, he made a flippant comment on text today about maybe the kids would just be better with his insurance pay out.
2. His 2nd marriage fails. If he thinks it's bad at the moment, having two divorces and two sets of kids to look after is going to be a hell of a lot worse.

I feel that leaving him to sort his own **** out will just end with things getting worse.
 
anth25 said:
Thanks for taking the time to reply.
My worry with waiting and not doing anything is;
1. He does something daft. I don't think he is in this position and I think his kids mean too much to him but how do you ever know. However, he made a flippant comment on text today about maybe the kids would just be better with his insurance pay out.
2. His 2nd marriage fails. If he thinks it's bad at the moment, having two divorces and two sets of kids to look after is going to be a hell of a lot worse.

I feel that leaving him to sort his own **** out will just end with things getting worse.
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1. Was probably a genuine joke as you say. You can lead a horse to water but you can't make them drink.
2. You can't do anything about his current marriage. Its out of your hands.

Appreciate you feel helpless but sounds like he needs to work this all out for himself. All you can do is answer the phone if he rings.
 
I think you can only do so much.

Be an ear to listen.
Be open- one thing i've learnt is that asking out right about suicidal intent is helpful. I know someone in a similar position- head is a mess, really struggling but I now know he doesn't plan on actually doing anything silly which is reassuring
Then signpost to what is available to support them.
They can decide if they want to access it and when.
 
Do you have a relationship with the mothers or his kids? If you don't you are probably not well disposed to do much more than lend a friendly ear or check in.
The decision is ultimately the children's (from the first marriage) to make regarding their travel. They will, eventually, appreciate that acknowledgement and hopefully reciprocate in future. That's your mates job to find out about their needs.

Tough love and ultimatums aren't helpful for anyone, ever.
 
I had a similar situation when I split up from my family. I had a really good mate who I saw regularly. What made him great was that he was a great listener. He wouldn't force advice on me, but I remember him saying that what ever I did the kids would remember.
He is probably going through the whole range of emotions, from anger through to depression. I would think that he would find it very hard to think logically as he would if he was not in the situation. As has been said above ultimatums are not the way to go, tough love will create anger and falling out.
If it is hard to talk, write to him or email. Let him know that you are there for him and be constructive in finding sources of help for him, that may be counselling or it may be a group of fathers who have gone through similar circumstances.

I got through my problems many years ago. I celebrated what I had and not what I had lost. I now have a great relationship with my adult kids. It isnt a parent/child relationship but something more adult. Time s a great healer.
 
atypical_boro said:
"I've tried to get him to talk to someone but he isn't having it. Doesn't think it will help."

That's all you can do mate. Don't be giving ultimatums. IMHO. Just wait until he wants you next.
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100% this. I was like this, it had to be me who asked for the help. You push him, you could make it worse. Just be his best mate, unless he is really going to do something stupid, then call 999 or crisis teams.

Places like Andy's Man Club were amazing for me, but it had to me who decided to go. You could suggest it and go with him, but only suggest it, it has to his decision.
Like minded people from different backgrounds and different reasons for being there but all wanting help with their mental health, not someone forcing them to go. Helped me hugely.
 
either goes and sees someone or me and him are done.. nah.. not that one.

he’s kids may well find the 40 minute drive a chore! maybe there’s some way he could make that work? laptop/tablet for homework maybe?

the separate house sounds like a nightmare scenario!

hmm, new missus has made some sort of compromise I guess and I’m sure she knew that he had kids when they got married. ideally she doesn’t want to be seen as the bad guy tho.. plus her kid has a brother and a sister she will want in their lives.

maybe offer to pay for therapy.. or at least sell the idea to him.. no threats or pull your socks up sort of stuff.. but if he gets his head round stuff snd maybe with a fresh take on how to manage these scenarios it will make him a better father, husband, ex husband & friend.

surely he can spare an hour over.. a longer drive or less time with his wife and new kid.

sounds rough.. no time with his kids will be enough.. plus new kid, new marriage a house move.. by the sounds of it new wife not happy.. kids are naturally upset.. and he’s coming off all.. ungrateful to his mate or summat.

Therapy?
Couples Therapy?
 
Two of our mates got divorced recently. He decided to move two and a half hours away with his new missus, who he’d been having an affair with. She wasn’t from there or anything but they just wanted to do it.

Not judging him, people have their own things going on in their lives, but must admit I could never work out why he’d made his life so difficult with that journey. 5 hour round trip (way worse with traffic) every other weekend for him and his son. Never sounded ideal and, predictably, the “amicable” divorce quickly became anything but amicable.

Up to him though I suppose. You never really know what’s going on in someone else’s head, regardless of how close you are to them.
 
I may not be a smart person. But I rather listen to religious teachings.The monk recommended that solving problems must be done consciously. If you still can't find a solution, stay calm.If there is any emergency problem, go in and take some action. But we must not hurry for the problem to be solved quickly.Because no problem will be solved, just because we want it to go away.We need time and our stillness to be able to live with that problem.
Always stay calm and collected.
 
Thanks for all the messages and for all confirming that giving him an ultimatum is a terrible idea!! Think I knew that already, it was just an idea that came from the feeling of helplessness. But as everyone has said I guess I need to just give him support and the time and space to sort it himself.



@sadgit I've read quite a bit about Andys Man Club. It sounds like such a great initiative. I have suggested it, as there is one close by in Wrexham and said I'd go with him but he isn't keen. Will try and suggest it again
 
Echo what others have said. Just be available to listen and not judge. Encourage him to talk to someone else. Talking is good!

https://hubofhope.co.uk/ is great resource to find local charities/organisations that may be useful. Does his work have an EAP? He maybe able to get help through that for free.

Samaritans and Shout are not just for in a crisis. It may be useful to talk/text a stranger?
 
anth25 said:
Thanks for all the messages and for all confirming that giving him an ultimatum is a terrible idea!! Think I knew that already, it was just an idea that came from the feeling of helplessness. But as everyone has said I guess I need to just give him support and the time and space to sort it himself.



@sadgit I've read quite a bit about Andys Man Club. It sounds like such a great initiative. I have suggested it, as there is one close by in Wrexham and said I'd go with him but he isn't keen. Will try and suggest it again
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Morning mate. It is bloody scary to walk through the doors, I walked around the block 20 times before I went in, one of the best things I did. Again it was my decision and it was me who had to be the one who wanted help. (I have stopped going after 18 months as I started to bring home other peoples problems and not deal with my own :D :D but it helped me learn not to hide away my struggles)
 
sadgit said:
Morning mate. It is bloody scary to walk through the doors, I walked around the block 20 times before I went in, one of the best things I did. Again it was my decision and it was me who had to be the one who wanted help. (I have stopped going after 18 months as I started to bring home other peoples problems and not deal with my own :D :D but it helped me learn not to hide away my struggles)
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Glad to hear that it has helped. I can imagine it being really daunting that first time. Not sure I'd be brave enough to do it on my own so fair play to you.

I've reached out to a couple of other lads in our group who he is good mates with but doesn't necessarily keep in touch with. I've asked them to get in touch and see if he is more open to talking to them. He might just be sick of hearing me saying the same things over and over. Hopefully they can get through and have a decent chat with him. A few have struggled themselves in the past so he might be more receptive to what they have to say
 
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