Is the Football bubble about to implode

[The_Big_Woodowski]

Is that true though? Everything I read suggests crowd numbers are rising throughout the pyramid, including non-league.

I don’t see how these team lower down can compete, sky high wages to stand still never mind aspirations of moving to the next level..

look at what has happened to the likes of Bury, Southend, Bolton, Scunthorpe, Derby, Stockport and am sure countless others.

I believe there are plenty others running at a loss and only takes a few injuries, bit of bad luck or a change in the sugar Daddy’s circumstances/ down turn in there business or personal life and priorities change, leaving the club without adequate finances to continue.

When clubs are paying more in wages than they have income something has to give.

With the big clubs or the top 20 taking so much of the revenue, and this gap growing year on year I believe we will reach a point where the pyramid as we know it can’t continue

 

[Lemmy_kilmister]

Blame Wilf Mannion! If it wasn't for him they'd all still be on a capped wage and making the tea at ICI after they retire!

Jimmy Hill started it TBF

 

[BaronSmoggie]

I am up North this week and wanted to go to the Argyle game. I tried to buy a ticket online. First I needed to create an MFC Digital Account, OK done. Then I select my ticket and go to purchase it. Then I need to create an MFC Ticketing account and link it to the digital account for some reference number to be entered. I gave up at that point. I'm not standing in the queue on matchday either. I was pretty surprised at the prices and a service fee for an online booking? I want to watch them, but I'm not made of frigging money. I'll continue to just watch the highlights as a working class dude.

Shame.

 

[Zoophonic]

To be honest I don't see how an alcohol sponsor isn't allowed on a kit and a betting company is. To me having a brewery sponsor means at least there's some people actually working to produce something and a community around that brewery being employed. A lot of these betting companies are just autonomous and empty money making machines, the moneys too good to turn down I know and that's why football is stuck with them at the moment. Imagine a world where we've got camerons/strongarm on the shirts again, I'd happily walk around with that on me shirt.

Betting company sponsorship on shirts comes to end in the 26/27 season. Think it would have come in sooner if it wasn’t for existing contractual relationships with clubs.

 

[BoroMart]

Betting company sponsorship on shirts comes to end in the 26/27 season. Think it would have come in sooner if it wasn’t for existing contractual relationships with clubs.

Big problem for stoke city isn't it? As they are largely financed by a betting company

 

[Zoophonic]

Big problem for stoke city isn't it? As they are largely financed by a betting company

Think it might only be shirt sponsorship. Bet365 can still own the club.

 

[BoroMart]

Think it might only be shirt sponsorship. Bet365 can still own the club.

Agreed but I’d bet that shirt sponsorship is very top end of what’s allowed

 

[uncle_rico]

I am up North this week and wanted to go to the Argyle game. I tried to buy a ticket online. First I needed to create an MFC Digital Account, OK done. Then I select my ticket and go to purchase it. Then I need to create an MFC Ticketing account and link it to the digital account for some reference number to be entered. I gave up at that point. I'm not standing in the queue on matchday either. I was pretty surprised at the prices and a service fee for an online booking? I want to watch them, but I'm not made of frigging money. I'll continue to just watch the highlights as a working class dude.

Shame.

Lots of pubs will be showing it

 

[WilliamMunny]

I don’t see how these team lower down can compete, sky high wages to stand still never mind aspirations of moving to the next level..

look at what has happened to the likes of Bury, Southend, Bolton, Scunthorpe, Derby, Stockport and am sure countless others.

I believe there are plenty others running at a loss and only takes a few injuries, bit of bad luck or a change in the sugar Daddy’s circumstances/ down turn in there business or personal life and priorities change, leaving the club without adequate finances to continue.

When clubs are paying more in wages than they have income something has to give.

With the big clubs or the top 20 taking so much of the revenue, and this gap growing year on year I believe we will reach a point where the pyramid as we know it can’t continue

If clubs are paying more in wages than income, they need to pay players less. There's no rule that says clubs have to overspend - the opposite actually - but so many do so in pursuit of climbing the pyramid. Do you think that would be any different if the Premier League gave them a bigger slice of the pie? I don't.

If every league 2 club was given an extra £2m a year and every league 1 club was given an extra £5m a year and every Championship club was given an extra £20m a year, all that would happen is each club would offer higher wages to attract the same players in an attempt to climb the ladder and receive the even higher income. And when those teams get so far then drop back down, bankruptcies would follow.

Alternatively, you could say all Premier League and Football League clubs equally share the TV riches and get, say, £40m each. The top clubs would stay at the top as a result of superior stadium revenue, sponsorship and merchandising sales. And those clubs with an average crowd of 5,000 will remain in the bottom two divisions, but would farcically be paying Joe Journeyman £30k a week that he simply doesn't deserve.

I'm not saying the current set up is perfect by any means, but IT IS POSSIBLE for teams to climb from the lower leagues to the PL. After all, Brentford, Brighton, Wolves, Forest and Sheff Utd are current Premier League sides to play in League 1 within the previous 15 years, whilst Bournemouth were in League 2 in 2009/10 and Luton outside of the Football League altogether only 10 years ago. The current top 4 in the Championship have also spent time in League 1 within the last 15 years, as well as in the PL (even winning it once!).

All the evidence shows that a well run club can, with a bit of luck, rise to the PL and stay there for a number of seasons. But it's not easy to stay there forever, nor has it ever been. Granted the super clubs will always dominate at the top, but that would be the case even with equal broadcasting income as Man Utd, for example, will always generate vastly more matchday income and merchandising revenue than Luton or Bournemouth, even if they drop into mid table for a period.

Personally I think it is great that non-league football is thriving and long may that continue. But the best supported clubs, and/or those with a wealthy sugar daddy, will always dominate at the top. Certainly that's been the case throughout my lifetime (I'm 50).

 

[NYboro]

I don’t see how these team lower down can compete, sky high wages to stand still never mind aspirations of moving to the next level..

look at what has happened to the likes of Bury, Southend, Bolton, Scunthorpe, Derby, Stockport and am sure countless others.

Marske United

 

[Decent_Left]

Agreed but I’d bet that shirt sponsorship is very top end of what’s allowed

Expect to see any any reduction in shirt sponsorship made up for in increased stadium/training ground etc sponsorship, they will be fine.

 

[JackG]

If clubs are paying more in wages than income, they need to pay players less. There's no rule that says clubs have to overspend - the opposite actually - but so many do so in pursuit of climbing the pyramid. Do you think that would be any different if the Premier League gave them a bigger slice of the pie? I don't.

If every league 2 club was given an extra £2m a year and every league 1 club was given an extra £5m a year and every Championship club was given an extra £20m a year, all that would happen is each club would offer higher wages to attract the same players in an attempt to climb the ladder and receive the even higher income. And when those teams get so far then drop back down, bankruptcies would follow.

Alternatively, you could say all Premier League and Football League clubs equally share the TV riches and get, say, £40m each. The top clubs would stay at the top as a result of superior stadium revenue, sponsorship and merchandising sales. And those clubs with an average crowd of 5,000 will remain in the bottom two divisions, but would farcically be paying Joe Journeyman £30k a week that he simply doesn't deserve.

I'm not saying the current set up is perfect by any means, but IT IS POSSIBLE for teams to climb from the lower leagues to the PL. After all, Brentford, Brighton, Wolves, Forest and Sheff Utd are current Premier League sides to play in League 1 within the previous 15 years, whilst Bournemouth were in League 2 in 2009/10 and Luton outside of the Football League altogether only 10 years ago. The current top 4 in the Championship have also spent time in League 1 within the last 15 years, as well as in the PL (even winning it once!).

All the evidence shows that a well run club can, with a bit of luck, rise to the PL and stay there for a number of seasons. But it's not easy to stay there forever, nor has it ever been. Granted the super clubs will always dominate at the top, but that would be the case even with equal broadcasting income as Man Utd, for example, will always generate vastly more matchday income and merchandising revenue than Luton or Bournemouth, even if they drop into mid table for a period.

Personally I think it is great that non-league football is thriving and long may that continue. But the best supported clubs, and/or those with a wealthy sugar daddy, will always dominate at the top. Certainly that's been the case throughout my lifetime (I'm 50).

This is an example of a Red Queen's race, from Lewis Carroll's 'Through the Looking Glass'. It describes situations where competitors devote more and more resources just to stand still.