Is reform of domestic football still needed?

Frozen Horse

Frozen Horse

Well-known member
Like everyone else, I'm very pleased that the ESL proposal has collapsed.

However, I don't think it has gone away for ever, and it's only a matter of time until something else is attempted.

Given the display of people power in the last few days, do you think we need to make the most of this momentum to protect and maintain competition at a domestic level?
I'd propose a flat rate salary cap for all teams in the PL; I know objectors call this trying to "artificially create" competition, but we accept "artificial limits" on competition already. What has the number of tacky shirts you can sell to kids in South East Asia got to do with football? Or how much a Chinese betting firm is prepared to pay to have you display their logo? These things may have been regarded as part of the game for a long time, but really they're not.

So instead of thinking about punishments of these 6 clubs, is it not the opportunity to push for a more equitable financial structure? One in which clubs are not always trying to push back the limit of what they can earn to feel like they're competing?
 
yes it is and now is the time to act with this threat having focussed minds. These rich clubs need raining back for their own good as well as the rest of the pyramid. Wage caps, agent caps, transfer caps are all ways to go but may fall foul of employment laws.
 
Yes, definitely. The momentum is now with reform and those shamed owners are in real retreat.

FSA issued a statement - 72 hours of white hot anger has killed domestic involvement in the ESL but that doesn’t mean fans can take their foot off the accelerator. A return to the status quo is unacceptable and will only allow unscrupulous owners to regroup.
Super League collapse: return to status quo is unacceptable
thefsa.org.uk

Super League collapse: return to status quo is unacceptable - Football Supporters' Association

Appeasement of football’s richest clubs doesn’t work. The vultures circle, they’re always after more and they only get stronger when you feed their greed.
thefsa.org.uk thefsa.org.uk
 
Overall club spending cap, unrelated to club income, may not be.

Let's even the league out, create a competitive domestic competition for all fans to enjoy and place European and global club success secondary to it.
 
There's not a cat in hell's chance they'll introduce a salary cap that limits the top clubs.

But they should be able to introduce mechanisms and punishments that prevent any clubs trying this **** again.
 
I think we need to seriously consider using the German model where 51% of a club is owned by the fans to avoid the likely event of unscrupulous owners regrouping to try something similar again in the future. We need the government on our side to force this change through to save our game for now and future generations!
 
but the whole problem with football is the huge amounts needed to pay current day transfers and wages. Reduce that problem and football finances could be fixed. Of course there is also the issue of greedy owners which needs another approach
 
I do think this will be the driver for checks and balances. An independent regulator will come in and serious fan representation in clubs. Already they have to meet fans several times a year. Many clubs, notably the selfish six pay absolute lip service to this but this will now be really toughened up. The FSA has all the evidence to submit and has been selected as the fans representative body.
 
I think if it was gonna happen it was now. The fact they've all retreated with their tail between their legs shows that they've realised who has the biggest influence on this issue and its the fans, not them.

I don't know if I think any major reform is needed. I would like it, but I don't think its feasible to introduce at the moment. There'll be some major fallouts behind the scenes at the 'rich 6' and fans are already disgusted with their own clubs.

I really think this might turn out to be good thing, without any need for further reform. I think it has put the debate to bed for another 20 years and may even weaken these clubs.
 
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Ironically a salary cap would benefit the US owners who want to make more profits from their club. It would also benefit Real Madrid and Barcelona, who otherwise seem unable to say no to players' ever increasing wage demands. Therefore the clubs should really be in favour.

Whether it is workable at a flat rate is doubtful however, as unlike the NFL for example, players play in more than one competition each season. Therefore players of the big clubs would argue, with some justification, that they should be paid extra for playing in Europe. One way around that would be to have a standard salary cap, but a separate players pool for prize money. That would be a true incentive for players to give a **** as the better the results, the higher the earnings. It would also prevent the endless cycle of successful clubs being able to use prize money to always outspend the opposition.

Obviously players and their agents won't be in favour of anything that reduces their pay packets, but even with a salary cap, the cream of the crop would continue to earn stupid money whilst any player with 10 years in the Premier League would still be set up for life. Meanwhile clubs will be profitable and therefore any attempt to squeeze more money out of fans would clearly be seen as profiteering, as opposed to being disguised as "we need more money to compete".
 
Yes, absolutely. There is so much wrong with football in the UK that something needs to be done, and this is hopefully the catalyst.

Just because the ESL has collapsed doesn't mean that the so called "big 6" aren't going to stop looking at ways to give them more power and money.

TV revenue - 91% goes to the 20 EPL clubs. The other 9% is shared between the other 72 clubs that make up the EFL. That has to change. Finances needs to filter down the leagues.

Ticket pricing. Twenty is Plenty needs to be applied across all 4 leagues for both home and away tickets.

Fit and proper owners test needs to be that and not just lip service. Too many clubs have got into difficulty, and the support doesn't appear to be there. We have basket case clubs like Portsmouth, Bury, Bolton and they should never have been allowed to get in those positions.

Regionalisation of the lower leagues should be considered. There is no sense or benefit in Carlisle playing Exeter on a Tuesday night in December.

There are loads of other things that need addressing too, such as safe standing and alcohol being allowed in seats.

Now feels like a good time for a root and branch review.
 
fmttmadmin said:
Yes, definitely. The momentum is now with reform and those shamed owners are in real retreat.

FSA issued a statement - 72 hours of white hot anger has killed domestic involvement in the ESL but that doesn’t mean fans can take their foot off the accelerator. A return to the status quo is unacceptable and will only allow unscrupulous owners to regroup.
Super League collapse: return to status quo is unacceptable
thefsa.org.uk

Super League collapse: return to status quo is unacceptable - Football Supporters' Association

Appeasement of football’s richest clubs doesn’t work. The vultures circle, they’re always after more and they only get stronger when you feed their greed.
thefsa.org.uk thefsa.org.uk
Click to expand...

This is great to see, thanks for sharing.

I agree a flat rate salary cap is unlikely, but not impossible.
I know American sports like the NFL have a salary cap, but it does seem to be pretty flexible.
I think 14 votes are needed to pass rules regarding the PL? Please correct me if I'm wrong. I actually think the players' union might be harder to get onboard with that.

I'd also like to see some sort of PL constitution enacted that enshrines promotion and relegation, and would require any club wanting to enter a closed-shop ESL to resign from the PL to do so.
 
Maybe when the next meeting is up regarding the future of the PL, football league that the powers to be show some strength & say the money is to be shared equally across all divisons, right down to the grass roots, not sure if its possible to carry out but it will show the 'greed is good super rich 6' that they dont call the shots no more

At least it will slow down the obscene gap increasing
 
Erimus74 said:
Maybe when the next meeting is up regarding the future of the PL, football league that the powers to be show some strength & say the money is to be shared equally across all divisons, right down to the grass roots, not sure if its possible to carry out but it will show the 'greed is good super rich 6' that they dont call the shots no more

At least it will slow down the obscene gap increasing
Click to expand...
I think all 6 owners are in need of some very good PR at present.
 
Erimus74 said:
Maybe when the next meeting is up regarding the future of the PL, football league that the powers to be show some strength & say the money is to be shared equally across all divisons, right down to the grass roots, not sure if its possible to carry out but it will show the 'greed is good super rich 6' that they dont call the shots no more

At least it will slow down the obscene gap increasing
Click to expand...
I'm certainly not against a more equitable distribution of cash, but I wouldn't be onboard sharing it equally across all divisions. Issue 1 - why should a 30 year old lower league journeyman playing in front of 3,000 earn the same as the top players in the Premier League? Issue 2 - all the top players would exit English football, thereby decimating the TV revenue and potentially making everyone worse off in the end.
 
The ills of football are the same as the ills of society, this is the ultimate expression of Friedmanism and it's notions of completely free markets, the clubs may have backed down for now but a compromise arrangement will be made that will see that those at the trough who would have lost out happily acquiesce to their own endorsed version of the Super League as long as their beaks remain dipped.

The heart and soul of football passed a long time ago, ask the fans of Bury, Bolton, Macclesfield etc where those so outraged by the potential loss of their primacy were when they needed support, tradition, community and competition where forgotten about then by those wiping crocodile tears from their corporate suits yesterday at the nascent break up of their cabal.
 
WilliamMunny said:
I'm certainly not against a more equitable distribution of cash, but I wouldn't be onboard sharing it equally across all divisions. Issue 1 - why should a 30 year old lower league journeyman playing in front of 3,000 earn the same as the top players in the Premier League? Issue 2 - all the top players would exit English football, thereby decimating the TV revenue and potentially making everyone worse off in the end.
Click to expand...
I would've thought the salary cap would be league dependant, i.e. in a higher league - higher weekly wage.
 
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