How Can Our Club Connect To You?

Who went to their very first match with a season ticket? I don't see how you can prevent a long term decline in attendances if walk-up prices aren't an attractive option.
That's a good point. I remember my first game, rocking up at the Holgate with £3.50 pocket money. Hooked from day one.

Now, £19 for kids**

F*ck. Right. Off.




** Yes prices getting reduced for next season, still shocking, banding absolutely out of touch. Using online calculator £3.50 in 1989 is £8.82 in 2024..........
 
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you could even do it at the Riverside, you know like - close to the club shop and the food stands - to you know, maybe bring in a little bit more money from families being able to have a nice day out.
Although I do like that idea, I think one of the big attractions for me is to visit Rockcliffe and actually see the training ground and how it looks on a day to day basis. I bit of an insight into a day as a footballer.
 
Not being pedantic, but the figures for attendances earlier were for the 22/23 season.
The actual figures for this season [23/24] are down to an average of 26,700.
The average earlier this season was over 27,000.
Since the Sunderland game at home, attendances have dropped to around the 25,000 mark.
Given that capacity is 34,742 [for now let's leave out segregation] that's over 9,000 empty seats.


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There are lots of reasons why so many feel such a disconnect. There will be dozens of things that different supporters want to change and make suggestions about.
Not all of them are possible of course.

For me there are 3 huge current failures to address:

1. Communication and PR is terrible.

The Club - or rather senior figures - communicate appallingly.
They don’t listen and appear uninterested in feedback, let alone criticism.
There is a distance, an arrogance, bordering on distain and contempt.

The utter fiasco around EB 2024 perfectly illustrates.

The audiences granted to approved select groups do not help. These groups don’t even communicate to the wider fans. How on earth can they claim to be, or be considered as representative?

Some of the attendees supposedly do challenge, but on what subject and in what way, we have no idea.
Everyone is so afraid of the elephant in the room.

Gibson does fund the losses made, he has no palatable alternative. So he is different in that respect to Amer.
But in the detached, removed, high handed way he operates, there are some glaring similarities.

2. Ticket price strategy is idiotic.

There is a perception that prices are too high, and then some complete idiots say the lunatic GRFZ should be extended everywhere.
Match day Prices versus EB in GRFZ is binary. Both opposing poles of stupidity.
EB SC prices do offer reasonable value.
All Concession EB SC prices offer good value.
GRFZ prices are unnecessarily low. The section generates far too little.
Yet match day attendees are positioned with insult pricing, making taking a family simply unjustifiable on anything other than a very occasional basis.
Treating new applicants as another premium opportunity is sad.
If I had paid over £120 on Saturday to take my missus and two primary school kids, I don’t think I would be rushing back soon.
The pricing structure is so stubbornly inflexible.
Our stadium could be full in the second tier, and in the top tier.
The notion the stadium is too big is coming from the vacuous brains that think MFC catchment area is only a part of the Tees Valley, let alone daring to extend into North Yorks or County Durham.
Of course our attendance is status and performance elastic, as it is price and experience elastic.
But it is mind numbingly dim to think that there can’t be pricing policy to flex with the other levers.
It is about having the skill to price and to communicate.

3. Commercial incompetence

Everything to do with the Commercial operation is shoddy: Range, quality, pricing, availability, presentation, service.
Not to recognise this implies you live underground and never leave home.
To leave so many and so much opportunity unsatisfied or dissatisfied is negligent.


There is for me a 4th reason for feeling a current real disconnect, but I accept it doesn’t seem to be for others.
I personally have absolutely no faith in Kieran Scott and this “model” of trusting a recruitment guru to provide a promotion winning squad whilst also generating huge transfer profits to offset the losses guaranteed in the Championship without Parachute Payments.
Kieran may short term deliver transfer profits, but we will languish where we are.
There are no players in the current squad who get me out of my seat, or even impact my heart rate. I wouldn’t care if any player left.
I do still care about Carrick because I saw what he did with quality last season. We didn’t go up, but played outstanding football and I felt a huge connection with that team.
Of course we need recruitment expertise, but implying Scott provides this is akin to thinking the only way to address ticket pricing is to extend the GRFZ.
 
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There are lots of reasons why so many feel such a disconnect. There will be dozens of things that different supporters want to change and make suggestions about.
Not all of them are possible of course.

For me there are 3 huge current failures to address:

1. Communication and PR is terrible.

The Club - or rather senior figures - communicate appallingly.
They don’t listen and appear uninterested in feedback, let alone criticism.
There is a distance, an arrogance, bordering on distain and contempt.

The utter fiasco around EB 2024 perfectly illustrates.

The audiences granted to approved select groups do not help. These groups don’t even communicate to the wider fans. How on earth can they claim to be, or be considered as representative?

Some of the attendees supposedly do challenge, but on what subject and in what way, we have no idea.
Everyone is so afraid of the elephant in the room.

Gibson does fund the losses made, he has no palatable alternative. So he is different in that respect to Amer.
But in the detached, removed, high handed way he operates, there are some glaring similarities.

2. Ticket price strategy is idiotic.

There is a perception that prices are too high, and then some complete idiots say the lunatic GRFZ should be extended everywhere.
Match day Prices versus EB in GRFZ is binary. Both opposing poles of stupidity.
EB SC prices do offer reasonable value.
All Concession EB SC prices offer good value.
GRFZ prices are unnecessarily low. The section generates far too little.
Yet match day attendees are positioned with insult pricing, making taking a family simply unjustifiable on anything other than a very occasional basis.
Treating new applicants as another premium opportunity is sad.
If I had paid over £120 on Saturday to take my missus and two primary school kids, I don’t think I would be rushing back soon.
The pricing structure is so stubbornly inflexible.
Our stadium could be full in the second tier, and in the top tier.
The notion the stadium is too big is coming from the vacuous brains that think MFC catchment area is only a part of the Tees Valley, let alone daring to extend into North Yorks or County Durham.
Of course our attendance is status and performance elastic, as it is price and experience elastic.
But it is mind numbingly dim to think that there can’t be pricing policy to flex with the other levers.
It is about having the skill to price and to communicate.

Commercial incompetence

Everything to do with the Commercial operation is shoddy: Range, quality, pricing, availability, presentation, service.
Not to recognise this implies you live underground and never leave home.
To leave so many and so much opportunity unsatisfied or dissatisfied is negligent.


There is for me a 4th reason for feeling a current real disconnect, but I accept it doesn’t seem to be for others.
I personally have absolutely no faith in Kieran Scott and this “model” of trusting a recruitment guru to provide a promotion winning squad whilst also generating huge transfer profits to offset the losses guaranteed in the Championship without Parachute Payments.
Kieran may short term deliver transfer profits, but we will languish where we are.
There are no players in the current squad who get me out of my seat, or even impact my heart rate. I wouldn’t care if any player left.
I do still care about Carrick because I saw what he did with quality last season. We didn’t go up, but played outstanding football and I felt a huge connection with that team.
Of course we need recruitment expertise, but implying Scott provides this is akin to thinking the only way to address ticket pricing is to extend the GRFZ.
Well said indeed. And an extra mark for using ‘uninterested’, rather than the (wholly incorrect in this context) ‘disinterested’.
 
Put on free coaches for certain away games, particularly when it's a long distance to travel.

It would have been a nice gesture to have put on free coaches for Plymouth away.

A lot of clubs seem to do this but I don't believe we ever have.
It was actually part of the discussion - free or heavily discounted coaches to Exeter - but fans forum and club thought that on balance why penalise fans driving, or on the train, plane or independent bus travel - better to discount all fans with a subsidised ticket price for the mid week game. They had to seek permission from EFL to do this and presumably pay Exeter City and the EFL the full ticket face value.
 
This comes closest to my thinking.
Do whatever it takes to fill the stadium. Not just for now, but with a long-term view.
The family zone is full. That's a success story - so extend it. Don't turn anyone away.
I know so many people who have been season ticket holders but we're given a reason now to renew and now never set foot in the stadium. Contact them! Get them back! Give them a reason to return.
The chairman should remove himself from the decision making process when it comes to setting ticket prices. They're not being made on a commercial basis. This year's ST campaign was commercial suicide and will shake the supporter base again. Many of them will never comes back.

Oh, and how about giving news fans the opportunity to obtain free drinks status after a qualifying period. I couldn't have an ST for personal reasons for many years and am now back with my kids. Doesn't feel great to pay the same as everyone else and see my fellow supporters getting a pint on the club every week.
The family zone has been extended this season - tickets sold NOT as season cards but deliberately on a match by match basis in a block adjacent to the Family Zone in the North Stand. But I don't know that it is well advertised. (I have edited after missing out NOT)
 
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When I hear that the club has a meeting with a certain fan, or two, because they're publicly announcing they aren't reneweing their season ticket, it actually annoys me more.

There'll be potentially hundreds if not thousands who won't renew for next season but won't be posting about it on every social media site going, that won't get this privilege.

Meeting with a couple of fans behind closed doors doesn't really solve anything.
You misunderstand me - they were very senior fans and said they had lost the love and price was also a factor in the decision. Rather than just 2 fans saying they wouldn't be renewing. It seemed worthwhile to try and hook them up with the club.
 
Put on free coaches for certain away games, particularly when it's a long distance to travel.

It would have been a nice gesture to have put on free coaches for Plymouth away.

A lot of clubs seem to do this but I don't believe we ever have.
These sort of initiatives sound good but who do they actually benefit? The same group of people that already have the strongest connection because they are regular attendees. They already get benefits because they have their season ticket and are front of the queue for in demand games because of their priority points.

There has to be some realisation that the majority of people are not the select few that already get all the attention. The club don't need to prioritise the away season ticket holders, max priority points holders, RF and the supporters forum attendees etc because those people will be there anyway. They need to start understanding why the majority of people feel disconnected and stop concentrating all their efforts on a handful of fans that are not representative of the majority.

Those people most likely have good intentions but they can't put themselves in other people's shoes.
 
The family zone has been extended this season - tickets sold as season cards but deliberately on a match by match basis in a block adjacent to the Family Zone in the North Stand. But I don't know that it is well advertised.
Sorry, is there a word missing there? As season cards or on a match-by-match basis? They're asking people to go on a waiting list at the moment for SCs. Will be madness if any get told there's no room.
 
1. Communication and PR is terrible.

The Club - or rather senior figures - communicate appallingly.
They don’t listen and appear uninterested in feedback, let alone criticism.
There is a distance, an arrogance, bordering on distain and contempt.

The utter fiasco around EB 2024 perfectly illustrates.

I don’t think anyone can really argue with this I know we are passionate fans and we defend them to other teams etc but our comms and PR are virtually none existent.

That insult of a SC renewal release email absolutely summed it up utter contempt and the absolute minimum.

The fact that so many are saying this on here a fan message board should send shock waves through the club.. as to why this is the case.
 
Add Boro art work between the subways from the cinema and the ground , it’s an eyesore with graffiti on the walls . Make it a spectacle . Funded by Middlesbrough council .
Sadly, Middlesbrough Council has no money whatsoever at present. And I mean NONE. But there are grant funders that could be applied to. We have just been successful in an award for a Fan Photo Exhibition and it is possible that we could build other projects with other grant funds from this in the near future.
 
Things that create an us and them divide:

* Priority points system.
* Differing prices for the same season ticket.
* Lack of transparency with the fans group.
* Not taking the fans wants and wishes into consideration (where the issue isn't financially sensitive)
* Poor communication all round.
 
Sorry, is there a word missing there? As season cards or on a match-by-match basis? They're asking people to go on a waiting list at the moment for SCs. Will be madness if any get told there's no room.
Sorry sold match by match deliberately not as season cards - so people can buy seats for a match without commitment to the season.
 
Our regular home fan base is not 30,000 and thats what is required to fill the Riverside. We did manage 30,000 season ticket holders for 2 seasons 1998/9 and 1999/2000 - we had had three cup finals and 2 promotions and were buying high profile players in a brand new stadium.

The Boro's catchment area is 450,000 people and if anything the number of people in that catchment area is falling slightly as people move away for employment.

Basically the stadium is a bit too big.
If you think the Riverside stadium should have a smaller capacity, and lower potential revenue (which will translate into actual revenue) then you're looking at reducing the potential status of the club so that you can enjoy your football in a cosy full ground.

I first went to Ayresome when we had a capacity of 53,000, and even though it wasn't filled while I was in it we did have crowds close to 40,000. You knew you were in a big crowd. In 1966 we reduced that capacity to 40,000 and people who could have been at the game with a larger capacity found themselves locked out of the bigger games.

Sunderland rarely sell out but their ground allows a lot more to attend at a reasonable cost. That's what you do as a community club. You let the community attend matches at prices that are affordable.

You don't penalise people who can't afford to spend on season tickets.
 
Sadly, Middlesbrough Council has no money whatsoever at present. And I mean NONE. But there are grant funders that could be applied to. We have just been successful in an award for a Fan Photo Exhibition and it is possible that we could build other projects with other grant funds from this in the near future.
They've had 30 years to sort out the areas surrounding the stadium, it is never going to happen regardless of whether the council have money or not.

It's not a fair comparison, but the areas surrounding Man City's stadium are brilliant. It really is a supporter's village. Just shows what can be done when the money is there.
 
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If you think the Riverside stadium should have a smaller capacity, and lower potential revenue (which will translate into actual revenue) then you're looking at reducing the potential status of the club so that you can enjoy your football in a cosy full ground.

I first went to Ayresome when we had a capacity of 53,000, and even though it wasn't filled while I was in it we did have crowds close to 40,000. You knew you were in a big crowd. In 1966 we reduced that capacity to 40,000 and people who could have been at the game with a larger capacity found themselves locked out of the bigger games.

Sunderland rarely sell out but their ground allows a lot more to attend at a reasonable cost. That's what you do as a community club. You let the community attend matches at prices that are affordable.

You don't penalise people who can't afford to spend on season tickets.
I know I am getting away from the point but those crowds of over 40-50 000 were always few and far between and must have been so totally unsafe. Do you remember how when the crowds were over 39k they would sometimes fill the South Terrace "Chicken Run" from the front by walking fans around the pitch and entering via gates through the pitchside wall. The reports of how the Holgate wall collasped v Oxford United in 66/67 promotion game are almost treated jovially now but those people were so, so lucky that they weren't seriously injured or killed when they spilled over each other on to the pitch. The official crowd was given around 42 000 but everyone says it was far, far higher. There were no safety officers or stewards in those days. No risk assessments. And no safety certificates. We were so lucky to get away with it.
Sorry to deviate.
 
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