Emergency Powers under Covid Act extended until October

I am a bit ambivalent about Labours stance on this. If they voted against the extension of emergency powers, they will loose and Johnson will use it against Labour and it will be mis-reported in the media.

It has limited political impact for Labour and I don't see any benefit in voting against it, but I can see some downsides. You could, quite rightly, argue that Labour should be voting in alignment with their beliefs, not for political gain, or damage limitation.

All that said, I am fuming that the government are doing this. They are treating us as sheep that need to be hearded, **** them. Comparing IQ's, Johnson is closer to a baboon than me. The government, and by that I mean the cabinet, and by that I mean Johnson are power hungry and, will not let go of the additional powers easily. We, the people, may have to take back those freedoms.

I do wonder what point we will have to get to before people think that protesting, in whatever way is necessary, is acceptable. At what point tory supporters will wake up and realise they are wealth generators for their masters.

There is a thread on here stating that covid passports for pubs is a good idea... Dear me, how did we get here? When will people wake up and realise that a world pandemic has been manipulated by a self serving government to enrich their friends and donors at the expense of our money and our lives, 140,000 of them.
 
HolgateCorner said:
Let Johnson get on with it and start attacking hard when the unemployment goes up, the taxes rise and the EU debacle takes effect.
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Do the Labour Party, and yourself, not realise how hypocritical that stance will seem when they have not only voted for the policies causing unemployment and tax rises, but done so with fewer dissenters than the governing party itself!

The voters will say well where the f were you when these emergency powers could have been curbed? Ah that's right, you voted to take a 6-month backseat. Very rich of you to attack in hindsight then!
 
Randy said:
Lib Dems seem to be the only opposition at the moment. All 10 of them in the house.
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How utterly grim democracy is when Lib Dems and a rag tag bunch of 'libertarian' (the press love making them out to be lunatics) tories are the only thing standing up for civil liberties... 😂
 
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I think Labour have missed a trick throughout by the pandemic by refusing to chip away at every decision made. The Conservatives can harp on about "following the science" as much as they want but a staggering number of decisions have absolutely no scientific justification, at least none that has been shared transparently with the electorate.

If they've made their bed at least make them prove that they're lying* in it

If they cannot, then question why not and what actually motivates these decisions.

*pun most definitely intended.
 
changingman said:
I think Labour have missed a trick throughout by the pandemic by refusing to chip away at every decision made. The Conservatives can harp on about "following the science" as much as they want but a staggering number of decisions have absolutely no scientific justification, at least none that has been shared transparently with the electorate.

If they've made their bed at least make them prove that they're lying* in it

If they cannot, then question why not and what actually motivates these decisions.

*pun most definitely intended.
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Indeed. For a start the whole notion of "following the science" is about as broad a brush you can use for these crazy policies. Which scientist informed on the Stanley Johnson loophole? Substantial meal? Staying local? 5 grand fine for going to an airport? Fines (never enforced) for not wearing a mask?

And did they ask a reasonable cross section of the scientific community or just the ones they fancied listening to?

All questions the Labour party has not bothered to ponder.
 
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All these votes on Covid legislation are lose lose for Labour with no chance of winning any. Either way they will be attacked and right now they believe not giving the Tories and their media clients a stick to beat them with is the lesser of two evils long term.

If they try to extend this in 6 months time and the vaccines prove to bring covid under control, thats when to go all out attack. If they still need to continue this due to another wave then that's another thing altogether.
 
Alvez_48 said:
You think everything Starmer does is right @HolgateCorner. 😉

When it comes to the next election and there's no optimism for Labour amongst the grass roots it will be because of issues like this.

There was no question regarding amendments to the extension, no questions about evidence of its effectiveness, need and reach.

It just makes both parties unpopular and when that's the case... Labour lose.

Here is the comment section sorted by most popular on the daily mail article in regards to the bill (strangely it wasnt covered in the guardian outside of a John crace sketch about the milk guy):-

View attachment 15970

See what happens? They hate Boris right now.. this is his base and they hate him but because Starmer offers nothing they sure as hell won't vote for him.
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I‘m a Labour voter (not a member or an activist) and I will always support the leader because I hate the Tories and everything they stand for.

My view on policy is that we are still three years from a general election and it’s that final run in with the right policies that will matter. Corbyn proved that in 2017 when with a good campaign he very nearly overturned a 20% Tory poll lead in 5 weeks.

With the correct policy on Brexit in 2019 the result would have been very close and Bunter certainly would not have had his majority. Corbyn called it wrong.

I think the Tories will have a strategic problem going into the 2024 election in that circumstances have meant they have had to spend absolute shedloads of money very early in the term, it will limit their usual tactic of trying to bribe the electorate in the run up to the election. I can see unemployment being high and inflation and Brexit causing problems.

So, in summary my belief is that it’s a long game and anything Labour do or don’t do just now does not really matter.

I think Starmer‘s doing ok though because the Tories really should be much much further ahead in the polls with all the money they have thrown at furlough and the way they have shut the country down to shield millions upon millions of elderly and vulnerable people. They should have bought a lot of those votes but there is little sign that they have, they’ve simply treaded water.
 
HolgateCorner said:
I‘m a Labour voter (not a member or an activist) and I will always support the leader because I hate the Tories and everything they stand for.

My view on policy is that we are still three years from a general election and it’s that final run in with the right policies that will matter. Corbyn proved that in 2017 when with a good campaign he very nearly overturned a 20% Tory poll lead in 5 weeks.

With the correct policy on Brexit in 2019 the result would have been very close and Bunter certainly would not have had his majority. Corbyn called it wrong.

I think the Tories will have a strategic problem going into the 2024 election in that circumstances have meant they have had to spend absolute shedloads of money very early in the term, it will limit their usual tactic of trying to bribe the electorate in the run up to the election. I can see unemployment being high and inflation and Brexit causing problems.

So, in summary my belief is that it’s a long game and anything Labour do or don’t do just now does not really matter.

I think Starmer‘s doing ok though because the Tories really should be much much further ahead in the polls with all the money they have thrown at furlough and the way they have shut the country down to shield millions upon millions of elderly and vulnerable people. They should have bought a lot of those votes but there is little sign that they have, they’ve simply treaded water.
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I don't think floating voters will be fooled by a party MIA, voting for another 6 months of no responsibility. A national crisis is not the time to sit on your salaries and play a "long game".

Starmer is rapidly making the Labour party a total irrelevance.
 
Colin Warnek said:
I don't think floating voters will be fooled by a party MIA, voting for another 6 months of no responsibility. A national crisis is not the time to sit on your salaries and play a "long game".

Starmer is rapidly making the Labour party a total irrelevance.
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An irrelevance that's clawing back Tory gains in the polls already after a vaccine bounce?

Your personal view of Starmer's tactics are fair enough, to then claim they are becoming irrelevant based on that view is ridiculous.
 
Chris_Boro said:
An irrelevance that's clawing back Tory gains in the polls already after a vaccine bounce?

Your personal view of Starmer's tactics are fair enough, to then claim they are becoming irrelevant based on that view is ridiculous.
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Only the Tories ever say Labour are becoming an irrelevance.

They’ve been saying it for years hoping everybody will believe them.
 
Colin Warnek said:
I don't think floating voters will be fooled by a party MIA, voting for another 6 months of no responsibility. A national crisis is not the time to sit on your salaries and play a "long game".

Starmer is rapidly making the Labour party a total irrelevance.
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I think you are wrong.

Starmer is sensible.

Corbyn defeating Johnson multiple times in the last Parliament may have looked like strong and effective opposition but it did him no good at the 2019 election did it?
 
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