Does Warnock's attitude towards officials count against him?

viv_andersons_nana

viv_andersons_nana

Well-known member
And therefore count against Boro?

This question has probably been asked or talked about on here before so apologies if I'm repeating stuff. But just a thought that Warnock has been known for slating referees and linesmen for decades. Even if they don't explicitly give things against his sides, they must on a subconscious level be affected by things he's said to them or how our bench behaves on the touchline. I know every bench will be up and down, shouting at them, but ours do seem to love getting stuck into the fourth official and whichever linesman is closest.

We have been on the end of some shocking decisions this season - Fry, I didn't think I'd see that one topped for years but it actually only took about 6 weeks. That was a disgraceful decision yesterday. We've had two red cards rescinded on appeal. It would be interesting to see how many other clubs have had red cards rescinded this season maybe. I think against Norwich as well, their left-back was on a yellow and took Folarin out with his elbow but wasn't sent off. The linesman was 3 yards away. Joe Bennett, on a yellow last weekend, elbowed Jonny Howson in the mush with the linesman 3 yards away but, again, nothing. If we get the free kick then how can't it be another yellow? What is the linesman actually saying in that instance?

It would be interesting to see how other teams' officials and supporters feel about referees, I know everyone thinks their team is on the end of more 'dodgy' decisions than the rest but Boro do seem to have suffered this season in ways we probably haven't in the past. I think we had some questionable stuff go against us when Aitor was in charge but I read an old interview with Hignett the other day and he said Karanka had told him his job on matchday was to hammer the fourth official. Which is fine but what does that actually achieve?

Apologies for rambling, but just wondered what people thought. We have genuinely had some shocking stuff go against us this season but referees are humans, they aren't intrinsically bad people intent on making sure Boro don't win games and get into the play-offs. Maybe Warnock should just try not talking about them for a while to see if it helps?
 
Last edited:
viv_andersons_nana said:
And therefore count against Boro?

This question has probably been asked or talked about on here before so apologies if I'm repeating stuff. But just a thought that Warnock has been known for slating referees and linesmen for decades. Even if they don't explicitly give things against his sides, they must on a subconscious level be affected by things he's said to them or how our bench behaves on the touchline. I know every bench will be up and down, shouting at them, but ours do seem to love getting stuck into the fourth official and whichever linesman is closest.

We have been on the end of some shocking decisions this season - Fry, I didn't think I'd see that one topped for years but it actually only took about 6 weeks. That was a disgraceful decision yesterday. We've had two red cards rescinded on appeal. It would be interesting to see how many other clubs have had red cards rescinded this season maybe. I think against Norwich as well, their left-back was on a yellow and took Folarin out with his elbow but wasn't sent off. The linesman was 3 yards away. Joe Bennett, on a yellow last weekend, elbowed Jonny Howson in the mush with the linesman 3 yards away but, again, nothing. If we get the free kick then how can't it be another yellow? What is the linesman actually saying in that instance?

It would be interesting to see how other teams' officials and supporters feel about referees, I know everyone thinks their team is on the end of more 'dodgy' decisions than the rest but Boro do seem to have suffered this season in ways we probably haven't in the past. I think we had some questionable stuff go against us when Aitor was in charge but I read an old interview with Hignett the other day and he said Karanka had told him his job on matchday was to hammer the fourth official. Which is fine but what does that actually achieve?

Apologies for rambling, but just wondered what people thought. We have genuinely had some shocking stuff go against us this season but referees are humans, they aren't intrinsically bad people intent on making sure Boro don't win games and get into the play-offs. Maybe Warnock should just try not talking about them for a while to see if it helps?
Click to expand...
I think your giving the referees too much credit.
 
Warnock’s rep definitely goes against him, it’s only human nature. Gibbo’s sue the FA comments won’t have helped.

what might help is if you are A self proclaimed “ classy” guy and your Dad is friends and mentor to the current refereeing Corps (corpse would probably be more accurate)
 
The whole standard of refereeing has come into question this season... not sure if its to do without the pressure of crowds being on them thus they feel braver or just that they are generally all crap and as a result it is showing up more with more matches being on the TV.

The change in rules this season in that they can't be approached after the game is also bizarre...

Their performance this season has been nothing short of shambolic (in the league in general... not just against us) and its almost bringing the game into disrepute. They are essentially influencing games that have millions of pounds riding on them when you think about promotions and league positions = investment and prize money.

I would also love to know what sort of financial scrutiny they are subjected to in terms of Betting and the likes... We all know how the asian betting markets love their late minute dramas.
 
I think there’s far too much coincidence of bad refereeing performances going against us for it not to be a factor. It’s not just Warnock, it’s the entire management team. I don’t think that approach works anymore, particularly when there’s no fans in the stadium and the constant barracking carries across the entire pitch.
 
I know this isn't the best way to look at things, but after this latest debacle, hopefully our ref next Saturday will soil his nappy and give every decision our way.

Alternatively he might be G*vin W*rd's best mate and take revenge on Warnock.

Alternatively he might try to be fair, but still be utterly incompetent like most of his colleagues.
 
viv_andersons_nana said:
And therefore count against Boro?

This question has probably been asked or talked about on here before so apologies if I'm repeating stuff. But just a thought that Warnock has been known for slating referees and linesmen for decades. Even if they don't explicitly give things against his sides, they must on a subconscious level be affected by things he's said to them or how our bench behaves on the touchline. I know every bench will be up and down, shouting at them, but ours do seem to love getting stuck into the fourth official and whichever linesman is closest.

We have been on the end of some shocking decisions this season - Fry, I didn't think I'd see that one topped for years but it actually only took about 6 weeks. That was a disgraceful decision yesterday. We've had two red cards rescinded on appeal. It would be interesting to see how many other clubs have had red cards rescinded this season maybe. I think against Norwich as well, their left-back was on a yellow and took Folarin out with his elbow but wasn't sent off. The linesman was 3 yards away. Joe Bennett, on a yellow last weekend, elbowed Jonny Howson in the mush with the linesman 3 yards away but, again, nothing. If we get the free kick then how can't it be another yellow? What is the linesman actually saying in that instance?

It would be interesting to see how other teams' officials and supporters feel about referees, I know everyone thinks their team is on the end of more 'dodgy' decisions than the rest but Boro do seem to have suffered this season in ways we probably haven't in the past. I think we had some questionable stuff go against us when Aitor was in charge but I read an old interview with Hignett the other day and he said Karanka had told him his job on matchday was to hammer the fourth official. Which is fine but what does that actually achieve?

Apologies for rambling, but just wondered what people thought. We have genuinely had some shocking stuff go against us this season but referees are humans, they aren't intrinsically bad people intent on making sure Boro don't win games and get into the play-offs. Maybe Warnock should just try not talking about them for a while to see if it helps?
Click to expand...
You could argue the other way, that Warnocks vociferous calling out of refs may actually want the ref not to want to put themselves in the firing line.
 
I do not think it's just incompetency, There have been too many really poor and dubious decisions that have gone against us this season I truly believe Gibson's attitude to the EFL and Warnock's attitude to refs has had a negative results on the outcome of 50/50 situations.
 
Train Guy said:
I do not think it's just incompetency, There have been too many really poor and dubious decisions that have gone against us this season I truly believe Gibson's attitude to the EFL and Warnock's attitude to refs has had a negative results on the outcome of 50/50 situations.
Click to expand...
Hmm nice conspiracy.. unfortunately it would require organisation and some level of competence to carry it out.

EFL rules are rules same with the refs.. they live for them, the only reason they exist is because of them.
 
The media dont like Neil because he tells them what they already know and isnt afraid to say so;
If he thinks a journo has printed rubbish - he tells them so.
When hes in front of a camera - he knows the interviewers Dad / Uncle / etc - they try to slate him, but hes right.
All power to him.
The establishment dont like the boat rocked.
What with institutionalised racism, sexism, homophobia, coaches convicted of offences against minors, alleged bungs, owners unfit for purpose and a dreadful record protecting players health - "football" should come out from up its own colon and take a long look in the mirror!
 
Norfolkred1 said:
I really could not imagine Fergie holding his breath, but then again he had the ear of the FA.
Click to expand...
I don't think citing Ferguson in Warnock's defence is the right way to go.

And I'm pretty sure that referees are no worse than they ever were. In fact they are probably a lot better than they were. Two things. Firstly they are under greater scrutiny than they have ever been. Look at all the camera angles we got for yesterday's incidents. Secondly we, as fans, don't know the laws any more. I know I don't. When I was little, the laws of the game were a few pages in the back of Rothman's and you knew them, almost by heart. They didn't change much either, just a bit of tinkering on how many steps the 'keeper could take and that was about it. Now they come in the form of a decent-sized paperback. They change all the time and there are pages and pages of how they should be interpreted. Referees need to know all this and they are regularly tested.

I didn't start this post intending to stand up for referees, but there you are. Yesterday's got a couple of things wrong. He probably feels bad about it this morning. There's no conspiracy, and I really don't think Warnock's attitude helps.
 
If it does surely that's essentially evidence of match fixing? Of course we're never likely to find out for sure.

That said, it could be argued that Warnock's comments yesterday also breach the definition of professionalism but difficult to fully understand when only "side" is held accountable for their actions.
 
I agree with the OP and my father in law (Forest fan) even said after the game that he felt the decisions go against warnock because deep down refs don't like him.

I know it could never be proved and it does sound like sour grapes, but in the 7th minute of injury time does the ref change his mind and give a penalty after initially giving a corner if it happens in the Swansea penalty area?

It has happened too often this season, the Blackburn decision whereby no officials see anything through to a last ditch tackle that the assistant sees but not the ref and ridiculous red cards that are rescinded after the game.

The trouble is it happens in the championship so the decisions don't go under the microscope like they do in the Premier League and the refs are allowed to carry on regardless.

Maybe we are just having a bad run with officials and things may change next season. As said before though, what really gauls me is when opposition managers agree with the decisions that are made even though they are putting their own integrity on the line (messes Mowbray and Cooper) and hopefully when 1 or 2 do go our way Neil will be big enough to say so (for the record I think he would as he just seems to call it as he sees it)

Anyway rant over, as you were.
 
I think the fact he’s a qualified ref doesn’t help either as it’s clearly personal with some of them.

As for it being just a conspiracy theory well just look at the evidence throughout his career I’d say it was an open and shut case.
 
Warnock's straight talking does nark the "higher ups" of the league, but yesterday was just really poor refereeing and the league should be able to recognise that, but of course they will not.

As for bad decisions being made against Boro, it's true that we have had more than usual this season, but these things have been standard treatment to us. Remember a few seasons ago when was it Albert Adoma "scored " with a great overhead kick at Leeds which was disallowed for dangerous play , when practically at the same time Rooney was claiming "goal of the season " for a similar effort.
Grin and bear it, we'll be going up next season.
 
Lottowyn said:
Warnock's straight talking does nark the "higher ups" of the league, but yesterday was just really poor refereeing and the league should be able to recognise that, but of course they will not.

As for bad decisions being made against Boro, it's true that we have had more than usual this season, but these things have been standard treatment to us. Remember a few seasons ago when was it Albert Adoma "scored " with a great overhead kick at Leeds which was disallowed for dangerous play , when practically at the same time Rooney was claiming "goal of the season " for a similar effort.
Grin and bear it, we'll be going up next season.
Click to expand...
We have benefited as well though. I remember Paul Wilkinson handballing it in against Bristol Rovers at Ayresome Park to give us a 2-1 win. Bristol Rovers were absolutely fuming, Boro went up at the end of that season by 2 points. Take that off and we'd be 3rd, below Derby on goal difference and in the play offs. I think Jimmy handballed it in against Newcastle once as well didn't he?

I agree with Capy really - we definitely over-scrutinise referees. Yesterday's stood out because it was genuinely ridiculous but it just seems that sometimes these narrow calls are going against Boro and it might be because our manager loves getting involved. Sometimes I can see his point - whilst disagreeing with how he airs that point much of the time - but there have been times this season when he's having a pop at full time, on the pitch, or in the press and I couldn't think of any reason why he'd be doing that. Boro had either made chances and not taken them, not made anything and not scored and therefore not won, or made a silly mistake at the back and dropped points. A lot of the time we were a bit unlucky, or came out of a very tight game on the wrong side. But somehow the ref is always getting slated, regardless of what's happened. I just wonder if that goes against Warnock.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top