Covid... Old Age and loneliness

ChrisTheRed

ChrisTheRed

Well-known member
Would you rather your elderly relatives or whoever spend a year without contact with you or anyone significant for that matter to "keep them safe" only for them to massively deteriorate and pass on as a result but having had an awful final year of their life?

I hear a lot of people call other "granny killers" etc. But I'm now starting hear via talk shows on radio from elderly that don't want to be kept safe and miss out on life and grandchildren with the understanding that they know they don't have long left in this world anyway.
 
My friends gran has never even held her 6 month old grand daughter, she’s seen her through a Perspex screen and that’s it. It’s definitely not their choice, the home she is in has made it for them. My mate is desperate to get a family photo of the three generations together before it’s too late.
 
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Blimey a very deep interesting question . I dont think theres a ' right or wrong ' every individual/family are unique .
Personally my mam is 88 and maintains just get on with it and if it happens , then it happens .
We the family naturally dont agree but she's fortunately of sound mind and maintains not getting out and about is debilitating her physically and mentally .
I guess you can label it as a die on your feet instead of living on your knees analogy
 
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UKLL1981 said:
My friends gran has never even held her 6 month old grand daughter, she’s seen her through a Perspex screen and that’s it. It’s definitely not their choice, the home she is in has made it for them. My mate is desperate to get a family photo of the three generations together before it’s too late.
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That's awful really. I mean how is she likely to feel about this deep down, that is a moment that she should be able to cherish and would bring immense joy and to have it taken away without her being given a moments thought is awful considering she may never get the opportunity moving forwards.

It's a sad time and the bigger picture really needs to be considered.
 
Borobarmy said:
Blimey a very deep interesting question . I dont think theres a ' right or wrong ' every individual/family are unique .
Personally my mam is 88 and maintains just get on with it and if it happens , then it happens .
We the family naturally dont agree but she's fortunately of sound mind and maintains not getting out and about is debilitating her physically and mentally .
I guess you can label it as a die on your feet instead of living on your knees analogy
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Tbh I'd agree with her. At 88 she is acutely aware of what is and isn't right for her and how to look after herself. Many elderly don't get close to that age.

If she is active as you say then going from that to sitting around doing not very much would have a significant impact on her I'd imagine.
 
Never that simple, from personal experience I have an elderly relative in a care home probably in the last few months of her life. Had virtually no contact with the outside world for months on end through lockdown and you cant imagine how tough that must be to spend your last days like that.
On the other hand, what is their other option, open up for visits and potentially let it spread through a home and kill everyone. Not really sure they can ever justify taking that sort of risk.
 
JM14 said:
Never that simple, from personal experience I have an elderly relative in a care home probably in the last few months of her life. Had virtually no contact with the outside world for months on end through lockdown and you cant imagine how tough that must be to spend your last days like that.
On the other hand, what is their other option, open up for visits and potentially let it spread through a home and kill everyone. Not really sure they can ever justify taking that sort of risk.
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So basically you're advocating just sacrificing the mental health and day to day wellbeing which is likely to lead to a quicker death so potentially save them from a quicker death? 🤔
 
ChrisTheRed said:
So basically you're advocating just sacrificing the mental health and day to day wellbeing which is likely to lead to a quicker death so potentially save them from a quicker death? 🤔
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What evidence are you using that suggests that mental health impacts are leading to a quicker death than covid?

But where in my post did I say that exactly?
 
JM14 said:
What evidence are you using that suggests that mental health impacts are leading to a quicker death than covid?

But where in my post did I say that exactly?
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So are you suggesting that loneliness and not seeing family would not lead to a downturn in mental health for the elderly?
 
ChrisTheRed said:
So are you suggesting that loneliness and not seeing family would not lead to a downturn in mental health for the elderly?
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Also didnt say that either, I just questioned if this was a quicker death than Covid as you stated?

Not really sure what the solution is tbh, either scenario is pretty grim. Just cant see many care homes being willing to take the risk of allowing visits when covid is so widespread. Look at how quick sickness bugs etc spread in that sort of environment, covid could practically kill off an entire home in a matter of weeks.
 
I have been on the sad end of this. My Mam (aged 89) was moved out of hospital into a Nursing Home in mid March as they wanted her out of hospital. She was able to get out of bed and walk to the loo with the aid of a walker in hospital. Once she was in the home she was in full lockdown and nobody could visit her.

For the first two months she was in a room upstairs where we could not see her at all. I bought a Portal to try to get to see her but the Wifi was so bad it would never connect so we had to rely on phoning her.

I managed to get her moved to a downstairs room where the family could visit and see her through the window. The change in her condition shocked me. She could not get out of bed as the carers rarely got her out of bed to move her joints (not a complaint with them but just a reflection on how short staffed and busy these people are).

Over the next months the family bought a phone with a holder that could have the phone above her bed so she could see us. We were never allowed in to see her and it was so hard to watch her condition deteriorate each week. I managed to get in to see her after a complaint to the Social Worker to get me in but this was a one off. She just spent all day in bed with no interaction. There were times we had to call the home as we stood outside to tell them Mam needed a drink of water. She did not have the strength to press the call button.

In July this year she passed without getting to see a lot of her family since February. I am convinced she would still be alive today if she had contact with the family and we could have got her out even in the garden and kept her active. However I still also wonder how I would have felt that without knowing it, somebody (even me) would have passed Covid on to her and to other elderly people in the home if they allowed visits.

I really feel for families and for the elderly as I would never wish the March-July heartache my family had but I would take the chance and see them as their quality of life is zero.
 
JM14 said:
Never that simple, from personal experience I have an elderly relative in a care home probably in the last few months of her life. Had virtually no contact with the outside world for months on end through lockdown and you cant imagine how tough that must be to spend your last days like that.
On the other hand, what is their other option, open up for visits and potentially let it spread through a home and kill everyone. Not really sure they can ever justify taking that sort of risk.
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Its a tough one I agree.

At some point though, the balance will have to swing from putting the very elderly at risk from covid first, to putting children with their whole lives ahead of them first. So far, children have just been at the bottom of the pile in terms of priorities. As we're now seeing with the Marcus Rashford episode, it simply cannot stay that way for much longer.
 
Every situation is different. My parents are in their 70s and are missing out on seeing the kids and family. But given that they're probably hoping for another 15 or 20 years then they aren't about to risk it given that it's "only" been 7 months.
 
wilkos_perm said:
Every situation is different. My parents are in their 70s and are missing out on seeing the kids and family. But given that they're probably hoping for another 15 or 20 years then they aren't about to risk it given that it's "only" been 7 months.
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Exactly, there'll come a point where they will want to start taking risks though, and who could blame them.
 
atypical_boro said:
Its a tough one I agree.

At some point though, the balance will have to swing from putting the very elderly at risk from covid first, to putting children with their whole lives ahead of them first. So far, children have just been at the bottom of the pile in terms of priorities. As we're now seeing with the Marcus Rashford episode, it simply cannot stay that way for much longer.
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Agree, but is there any solution to any of this that isnt going to harm a different part of society?


Really sorry to hear that Ayresome, absolutely heart breaking
 
It's a tough one, it really is. Going about your daily business to help your quality of life may mean someone else has to die?

Hopefully the trend we're seeing of the death ratio coming down is a reality, not simply because we're at the start of the upward curve, as happened during the earlier part of the year.
 
JM14 said:
Agree, but is there any solution to any of this that isnt going to harm a different part of society?


Really sorry to hear that Ayresome, absolutely heart breaking
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Give people the relevant information and let THEM make the choice. That is the only way forward. Taking away people's freedoms, in the long run, will prove to be FAR more damaging than this virus.

Just because you say someone can go out and meet someone doesn't mean they have to. We know enough about the virus now to publish meaningful facts and figures and allow people to build their own risk profile and strategy for coping.
 
Ayresome said:
I have been on the sad end of this. My Mam (aged 89) was moved out of hospital into a Nursing Home in mid March as they wanted her out of hospital. She was able to get out of bed and walk to the loo with the aid of a walker in hospital. Once she was in the home she was in full lockdown and nobody could visit her.

For the first two months she was in a room upstairs where we could not see her at all. I bought a Portal to try to get to see her but the Wifi was so bad it would never connect so we had to rely on phoning her.

I managed to get her moved to a downstairs room where the family could visit and see her through the window. The change in her condition shocked me. She could not get out of bed as the carers rarely got her out of bed to move her joints (not a complaint with them but just a reflection on how short staffed and busy these people are).

Over the next months the family bought a phone with a holder that could have the phone above her bed so she could see us. We were never allowed in to see her and it was so hard to watch her condition deteriorate each week. I managed to get in to see her after a complaint to the Social Worker to get me in but this was a one off. She just spent all day in bed with no interaction. There were times we had to call the home as we stood outside to tell them Mam needed a drink of water. She did not have the strength to press the call button.

In July this year she passed without getting to see a lot of her family since February. I am convinced she would still be alive today if she had contact with the family and we could have got her out even in the garden and kept her active. However I still also wonder how I would have felt that without knowing it, somebody (even me) would have passed Covid on to her and to other elderly people in the home if they allowed visits.

I really feel for families and for the elderly as I would never wish the March-July heartache my family had but I would take the chance and see them as their quality of life is zero.
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Blimey may I pass on my condolences
 
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