Boro managers DO NOT chuck the cups away

r00fie1

Well-known member
It means we’ve been knocked out of a cup to lower-league opposition. Again. How many times in the past 4 or 5 years is that now?

I can’t get my head around the idea that there are Boro supporters apparently rejoicing in this, in this defeat. It’s mad.

You shouldn’t be making excuses for it.

Thank f*ck Sir Lennie Lawrence never felt the same way as some Boro supporters do. He had the thinnest squad of them all and tried to win all FOUR competitions we were in. That’s what the Boro are about.
Viv - by that logic, it means that none of our Managers in 4 out of the last 5 seasons have cared about the League Cup - so its not just that horrible Chris Wilder? Only a twisted fool would "rejoice" in Boro being defeated in the 93rd minute - but its not the end of the world. Bring on Sunday(y)
 

r00fie1

Well-known member
Bull. We were poor, they were just worse. You do have to give youngsters a chance, when they're ready for it and surrounded by senior pros, not other kids.
When and how do we judge youngsters to be "ready"?
Its obvious that youngsters will make mistakes, but need to learn. In which games do we give these kids a chance? Sonny Finch for instance?
 

Cuthbert

Well-known member
Clearly not what I mean.

But: View attachment 42638

Wilder seems bullish on the fact we're bringing 5 more in.

The squad that started the window will be different to the squad that ends it.
I hope you're right mate. However, I feel like we've been in this position before, and then all been left feeling somewhat underwhelmed when the window closes! 🤞
 

weststandwally

Well-known member
Barnsley made 5 or 6 changes from the team that played on Saturday. Their fans were moaning before kick off about the selection.

It was a chance to give the fringe players a game. Just about every team in the competition does it.

Didn’t work tonight but easily could have. I honestly can’t believe people are getting worked up about it.
Agree,the 'easily upset'are in their element at the moment, we have lost to plenty of lower league sides in cup competitions with a full strength side on the pitch and there has been less whinging.
 

Corco65

Well-known member
I think you should always play your best side to win any game of competitive football, it seems we are part of the trend to play weakened teams in cups, becuase x matters more, which started in the top flight and has now filtered down the leagues and we buy into it.

I would also say, to all the supporters who were desperate for us to win and for those who could, why weren't you there tonight? Thinking about ticket sales and general interest, there seemed little appetite from the fans for the match, perhaps the club have matched the supporters ambition.
 

TeaCider

Well-known member
I hope you're right mate. However, I feel like we've been in this position before, and then all been left feeling somewhat underwhelmed when the window closes! 🤞

Absolutely, our managers are often promised the moon and get a rock, I'm not laying all my hope on it.

But it's rare we've had a manager so adamant of the specific positions we're bringing in.
I can't judge how I feel about our chances until I've seen whether he's right on what we're bringing in.
 

viv_andersons_nana

Well-known member
Viv - by that logic, it means that none of our Managers in 4 out of the last 5 seasons have cared about the League Cup - so its not just that horrible Chris Wilder? Only a twisted fool would "rejoice" in Boro being defeated in the 93rd minute - but its not the end of the world. Bring on Sunday(y)
Horrible Chris Wilder? I love Chris Wilder, roofie. I think he’ll take us up. I also think he should be playing a much stronger team for last night’s game. I don’t like the idea that some of our fans appear to be pleased we’ve lost a game. When they play the next round of League Cup games, I’ll be disappointed we’re not playing as well.

I said the same when Pulis and Warnock played weakened sides(even though Pulis’ two young sides won a couple of games). Warnock sacked it off last season and for what? To have us languishing in 14th place and ending up sacked.

I mentioned before, whenever the Boro have gone up or had a real promotion push there’s almost always been a cup run alongside it. Certainly in all the time I’ve been going to watch us. Lennie’s Lions at Old Trafford and Hillsborough, Robbo taking us to Wembley in ‘98, Karanka beating both Manchester sides, Wilder last season. Those are what people remember. Even Sir Bruce, those Everton games are some of the most memorable of his era.

We don’t throw cup games or games of football away. I’m surprised so many people seem to be pleased with a defeat at home to third division opposition - again - and that so many are prepared to make excuses for it.
 

GazC_MFC

Well-known member
It means we’ve been knocked out of a cup to lower-league opposition. Again. How many times in the past 4 or 5 years is that now?

I can’t get my head around the idea that there are Boro supporters apparently rejoicing in this, in this defeat. It’s mad.

You shouldn’t be making excuses for it.

Thank f*ck Sir Lennie Lawrence never felt the same way as some Boro supporters do. He had the thinnest squad of them all and tried to win all FOUR competitions we were in. That’s what the Boro are about.
Comparing to Lennie Lawrence, when sport science etc wasn’t really as prominent as now

I would prefer boro to win, but I understand the predicament the manager is currently in
 

r00fie1

Well-known member
Horrible Chris Wilder? I love Chris Wilder, roofie. I think he’ll take us up. I also think he should be playing a much stronger team for last night’s game. I don’t like the idea that some of our fans appear to be pleased we’ve lost a game. When they play the next round of League Cup games, I’ll be disappointed we’re not playing as well.

I said the same when Pulis and Warnock played weakened sides(even though Pulis’ two young sides won a couple of games). Warnock sacked it off last season and for what? To have us languishing in 14th place and ending up sacked.

I mentioned before, whenever the Boro have gone up or had a real promotion push there’s almost always been a cup run alongside it. Certainly in all the time I’ve been going to watch us. Lennie’s Lions at Old Trafford and Hillsborough, Robbo taking us to Wembley in ‘98, Karanka beating both Manchester sides, Wilder last season. Those are what people remember. Even Sir Bruce, those Everton games are some of the most memorable of his era.

We don’t throw cup games or games of football away. I’m surprised so many people seem to be pleased with a defeat at home to third division opposition - again - and that so many are prepared to make excuses for it.
The "horrible Chris Wilder" is a throw at those who hate the man and all he lives and breaths. Maybe should have made that clearer. Apologies.
It seems we all sometimes get sucked into the minutiae of the game and miss the big picture.
UTMB
(y)
 

festa5

Well-known member
If we win on Sundays last nights selection was a fantastic decision. That’s the reality
its also not just about sunday. Wilder is thinking much longer term than that. He's already spoken at length about having to take Forss off v QPR, not just because he was tiring, but because fatigue leads to injuries.

our injury record under Wilder is excellent. He places a massive value on sports science. Anyone moaning that "well players could get injured in training or the first 5 mins on Sunday" are completely missing the point. A lot of injuries are "overuse injuries" (i think Wilder has called them). Weve got a tiny squad and a lot of matches to get through before we hopefully have a full squad.

flogging the first team players into the ground in the meantime risks adding to that issue. He's managing the risk based largely on what the science is telling him.

Maybe hes wrong. But he's coming at it from a far better informed position than your average fan.
 

viv_andersons_nana

Well-known member
Comparing to Lennie Lawrence, when sport science etc wasn’t really as prominent as now
His team played around 60 games that season, largely on mud, and won automatic promotion. We knocked first division Manchester City out of both cups, won at Hillsborough(that Sheffield Wednesday side reached both cup finals the next year I think), and outplayed United at Old Trafford in a semi final.

And we can’t play a game at home to Barnsley in August? They’ve already scrapped the two-legged format. Imagine some of these managers and players having to play TWO legs now! Can you imagine that. There’d be hell on. The nerve of expecting Giles or Crooks or McGree to have to play against Barnsley!
 

viv_andersons_nana

Well-known member
its also not just about sunday. Wilder is thinking much longer term than that. He's already spoken at length about having to take Forss off v QPR, not just because he was tiring, but because fatigue leads to injuries.

our injury record under Wilder is excellent. He places a massive value on sports science. Anyone moaning that "well players could get injured in training or the first 5 mins on Sunday" are completely missing the point. A lot of injuries are "overuse injuries" (i think Wilder has called them). Weve got a tiny squad and a lot of matches to get through before we hopefully have a full squad.

flogging the first team players into the ground in the meantime risks adding to that issue. He's managing the risk based largely on what the science is telling him.

Maybe hes wrong. But he's coming at it from a far better informed position than your average fan.
But how is a league cup tie in August ‘flogging them into the ground’? Looking at our second half against West Brom and what happened at QPR, these lads NEED to be playing together and building themselves into a unit.

My point about pressure is to do with Sunday’s result. You have to win it now. You’ve got no excuses for not winning as the lads will be completely fresh.
 

viv_andersons_nana

Well-known member
How many of us were bemoaning how knackered our midfield where at the end of last season. Do we want players to burn out quicker and go longer in the cup or do we want some compromise to ensure we give ourselves the best chance of a higher league finish as possible
I understand your point but I want us to win games of football. You can rest one or two, blood a youngster or two, but not what happened last night. It’s just my opinion.
 

GazC_MFC

Well-known member
His team played around 60 games that season, largely on mud, and won automatic promotion. We knocked first division Manchester City out of both cups, won at Hillsborough(that Sheffield Wednesday side reached both cup finals the next year I think), and outplayed United at Old Trafford in a semi final.

And we can’t play a game at home to Barnsley in August? They’ve already scrapped the two-legged format. Imagine some of these managers and players having to play TWO legs now! Can you imagine that. There’d be hell on. The nerve of expecting Giles or Crooks or McGree to have to play against Barnsley!
I think we all can admit that the demands on a player playing 60 games is early 90’s to now are totally different. Players at all levels now have bodies of elite sportspeople. The demands are really high.

We can expect them to play against Barnsley, but as my last post there has to be compromise. Wilder picked a team who he thought could win the game. Let’s be honest that team should have won.

A cup run is nice, but I think a little perspective is needed in terms of our current situation
 

Chappy112

Well-known member
I think you should always play your best side to win any game of competitive football, it seems we are part of the trend to play weakened teams in cups, becuase x matters more, which started in the top flight and has now filtered down the leagues and we buy into it.

I would also say, to all the supporters who were desperate for us to win and for those who could, why weren't you there tonight? Thinking about ticket sales and general interest, there seemed little appetite from the fans for the match, perhaps the club have matched the supporters ambition.
It’s not just an idea that the clubs came up with and everyone else bought into it. Clubs prioritise what benefits them most financially.
 

Canyoudigit

Well-known member
Although the 2 cup finals and relegated season was memorable,if we would have been knocked out early doors in both of them the team we would have had the following season would arguably have been the best in the clubs history.
I was there last night and have no issues whatsoever with team selection
Horrible Chris Wilder? I love Chris Wilder, roofie. I think he’ll take us up. I also think he should be playing a much stronger team for last night’s game. I don’t like the idea that some of our fans appear to be pleased we’ve lost a game. When they play the next round of League Cup games, I’ll be disappointed we’re not playing as well.

I said the same when Pulis and Warnock played weakened sides(even though Pulis’ two young sides won a couple of games). Warnock sacked it off last season and for what? To have us languishing in 14th place and ending up sacked.

I mentioned before, whenever the Boro have gone up or had a real promotion push there’s almost always been a cup run alongside it. Certainly in all the time I’ve been going to watch us. Lennie’s Lions at Old Trafford and Hillsborough, Robbo taking us to Wembley in ‘98, Karanka beating both Manchester sides, Wilder last season. Those are what people remember. Even Sir Bruce, those Everton games are some of the most memorable of his era.

We don’t throw cup games or games of football away. I’m surprised so many people seem to be pleased with a defeat at home to third division opposition - again - and that so many are prepared to make excuses for it.
Playing devil's advocate, if we hadn't had the cup runs in 96/97 we would arguably have ended up with the most exciting team in our history, juninho behind Romario and Ravanelli anyone?
 

Chappy112

Well-known member
His team played around 60 games that season, largely on mud, and won automatic promotion. We knocked first division Manchester City out of both cups, won at Hillsborough(that Sheffield Wednesday side reached both cup finals the next year I think), and outplayed United at Old Trafford in a semi final.
All teams did that though so it wasn’t an issue. As soon as one team starts resting players and bringing in sports science you’re at a huge disadvantage.
 
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