Archie Battersbee

[coluka]

Just been reading the ins and outs of this terribly upsetting dilemma. My heart goes out to his parents, they have undoubtedly done everything to keep their hope and belief their son just needs time. I am uncomfortable that the courts decide, not the parents, but I also understand why.

It must be every parents nightmare and I have had a frank debate regarding me and my beloved if in a similar circumstance. Our opinions were mixed and I was frankly shocked. I fully support the mother in her attemts to play for time. I feel a date should be negotiated though, but again i am at a loss to say what that time and date should be.

The parents need to feel every effort has been made and reasonable time has been given for change to occur, but equally if life is gone a machine isn’t the answer either. I feel so torn on the matter and just want Archie and his parents to somehow to find peace In a negotiated solution. 😔

 

[El Guapo]

I find it very difficult to read. My heart truely goes out to them and indeed anyone is such situations. Incredibly sad circumstances. Heartbreaking.

 

[red_clowne]

As a parents of a child damaged at birth I can, to an extent, emphasise with his parents. Our son, Mike, is.now 41 and is a blessing to us. He will always be a child and need constant help and support but, we never had to face the choices that Archie's parents are now confronting. Our thoughts are with them.

 

[Legz]

I read the court papers last night. I whole heartedly feel for the parents but from the medical reports it's obvious poor Archie has been "gone"since the day of the incident.
I was also a bit uncomfortable with the mam saying about "executing kids" on TV as, as I read the medical reports it seems that what the parents actually want is for Archie to stay on the machine until he goes naturally in a few weeks and not because the doctors are turning his machine off. The decline in Archie, the medical interventions that are taking place hourly etc, it's not just a boy on a machine and apparently the nurses caring for him are getting visibly distressed by his appearance now which is why I think the hospital are doing what they are.
Either way it's an awful awful situation for both sides to be in

 

[FabioPorkpie]

Truly awful situation and my heart goes out to that little boy, his family, those that are caring for him and those that are embroiled in all the legal stuff.
I cannot imagine what his parents must be going through, knowing that today is the day their little boy goes to sleep forever. Some things in life are just too cruel to comprehend.

 

[MolteniArcore]

What the parents actually want is for Archie to stay on the machine until he goes naturally in a few weeks and not because the doctors are turning his machine off.

That's interesting as from the media coverage I got the impression they believed he needed time as they thought he would recover.

A truly horrific situation for the parents and family but I tend to think that the doctors know best and it's time for the court action to stop and him to be allowed to pass.

It is heartbreaking for all involved.

 

[Decent_Left]

A colleague at work had the horror of her husband suffering a spontaneous subarachnoid haemorrhage on Boxing Day just gone. He was on life support for 3 weeks when she made the decision to turn it off.

It was horrific for her and she read up on all the medical stuff some of which indicated he may come back. She returned to work in June and in a candid moment mentioned it was the glimmer of hope that made it so difficult as she had held of flicking the switch for 2 weeks.

She's not recovered and probably wont ever, lost loads of weight and looks haunted. She's quite different now.

Hope to whatever that I am never in this situation.

I feel for the parents in this lads case so much as searching the internet you will always find something that supplies a little chink of hope right or wrong.

 

[Priv]

That's interesting as from the media coverage I got the impression they believed he needed time as they thought he would recover.

A truly horrific situation for the parents and family but I tend to think that the doctors know best and it's time for the court action to stop and him to be allowed to pass.

It is heartbreaking for all involved.

Same, surely hes unlikely to go naturally as all his bodily functions are being ran artifically. Everything ive read including quotes from his mother is them saying hes being executed and needs more time and demanding stem cell treatments and to let him fight etc, saying UK health care has let them down, there is nothing about letting him die naturally, and surely being attached to a machine thats keeping him alive is completely unnatural and contradicts her own argument.

Im sorry I know its an emotive subject and id hate to be in that situation but they havent let her down, they have tried their best and now know there is nothing more they can do for him. Its a horrible situation but likewise she shouldnt be pointing the blame at others and tieing doctors up in court cases that will be badly needed for other children that desperately need help.

 

[Corcaigh_the_Cat]

Unfortunately that's the problem we're having with the news media. They've stopped telling the truth and are playing with the population.

I know 'experts' (doctors in this case) get stick due to the one in a million they get wrong but sometimes we have to go with their advice.

It's incredibly hard for the family as it is for any family losing a child but the resources being spent on poor Archie would be better employed on caring for those with a chance of survival.

 

[Frozen Horse]

Just been reading the ins and outs of this terribly upsetting dilemma. My heart goes out to his parents, they have undoubtedly done everything to keep their hope and belief their son just needs time. I am uncomfortable that the courts decide, not the parents, but I also understand why.

Lots of thoughtful comments on this thread.

My first thought is that it isn't simply the courts that decide what happens; it's the courts informed by medical experts.
As you say, this must be every parents' worst nightmare, and I cannot comprehend what they are going through. At the same time, I find myself thinking this is why they should not have the final decision: who could possibly make a rational decision in those circumstances? Although I don't blame them in the least for this, I suspect they are now acting more in their own interests (i.e. convincing themselves they've done everything) rather than in Archie's, even if they don't see it like this. I'm not accusing them of being selfish: their mental health is important too and, for their well-being, I do see a point in going through this process, but I can't believe it's in Archie's best interest.

I was also a bit uncomfortable with the mam saying about "executing kids" on TV as, as I read the medical reports it seems that what the parents actually want is for Archie to stay on the machine until he goes naturally in a few weeks and not because the doctors are turning his machine off.

"Naturally" is an odd way of viewing it; his body is only alive now due to artificial intervention. I don't want to comment on details of an individual case without first hand knowledge, but we can ventilate a body by pumping air in and out of the lungs; we can provide all the nutrition needs intravenously, and we can make the heart beat artificially through a number of pacing devices. None of this is natural. The ventilation in particular can often be mistaken by relatives for the patient trying to breath themselves. Ultimately, the chance for a "natural" death ended with the attempt to save his life.

As has been said, it's a horribly difficult situation. I do feel the courts have made the correct decision. However, his parents do need to feel they've done all they can too.

 

[Legz]

Lots of thoughtful comments on this thread.

My first thought is that it isn't simply the courts that decide what happens; it's the courts informed by medical experts.
As you say, this must be every parents' worst nightmare, and I cannot comprehend what they are going through. At the same time, I find myself thinking this is why they should not have the final decision: who could possibly make a rational decision in those circumstances? Although I don't blame them in the least for this, I suspect they are now acting more in their own interests (i.e. convincing themselves they've done everything) rather than in Archie's, even if they don't see it like this. I'm not accusing them of being selfish: their mental health is important too and, for their well-being, I do see a point in going through this process, but I can't believe it's in Archie's best interest.



"Naturally" is an odd way of viewing it; his body is only alive now due to artificial intervention. I don't want to comment on details of an individual case without first hand knowledge, but we can ventilate a body by pumping air in and out of the lungs; we can provide all the nutrition needs intravenously, and we can make the heart beat artificially through a number of pacing devices. None of this is natural. The ventilation in particular can often be mistaken by relatives for the patient trying to breath themselves. Ultimately, the chance for a "natural" death ended with the attempt to save his life.

As has been said, it's a horribly difficult situation. I do feel the courts have made the correct decision. However, his parents do need to feel they've done all they can too.

When I said naturally I was using the terms on the court papers. They said that his organs and his heart will start to fail and, even with him being on a machine. There's also evidence in them from his mam saying he always said he would never leave her and that Archie had had a conversation with a family member about something like this happening.
It's such a sad case, I just feel for all involved

 

[Frozen Horse]

When I said naturally I was using the terms on the court papers. They said that his organs and his heart will start to fail and, even with him being on a machine. There's also evidence in them from his mam saying he always said he would never leave her and that Archie had had a conversation with a family member about something like this happening.
It's such a sad case, I just feel for all involved

Understood; I didn't think it was your choice of word. The word still strikes me as an inaccurate description of what will follow.

 

[BobUpnDown]

Who decides, interesting read https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-62390504

 

[LowMoorBoro]

It’s such an awful story. I can see from both sides why they are doing what they are doing, however reading some of the backing the Mother has received from some Christian groups is interesting.

 

[Blf]

I can't even imagine what this family is going through. I can't even bring myself to read about it. My only thought is it seems to be happening too quickly. There seems to be little time between court cases and appeals. One thing the parents should be afforded is time.

 

[sweet_left_foot]

It is terribly sad.
The courts could be focussing their attention on bringing TikTok to account on corporate manslaughter charges and banning their algorithm from pushing dangerous online challenges to children who don't have the cognitive ability to discern that these actions might bring the kids fame for the wrong reasons.

 

[stjohn]

I really don't know where I stand on this. Can see both sides but my heart really does go out to the parents. So incredibly sad.

 

[Muttley]

Having had a quick read of some of the medical analysis of the poor lad it is plain to me that he is dead already. Incredibly sad but time to put him to his rest, this fighting over the treatment of his moribund body isn't doing his parents any kindness.

 

[Chris_Boro]

Just read the court reports and I really wish I hadn't. This is all so terribly sad, the poor lad is in a state of necrosis, the mother's head is being filling with false hope and is desperately klinging on and lashing out.

The NHS and all the staff have tried everything to save Archie and do not deserve the abuse they are getting. I can't imagine the pain his parents are going through and I hope they are also getting the help they need.

 

[Chris_Boro]

It is terribly sad.
The courts could be focussing their attention on bringing TikTok to account on corporate manslaughter charges and banning their algorithm from pushing dangerous online challenges to children who don't have the cognitive ability to discern that these actions might bring the kids fame for the wrong reasons.

There's no evidence any of this tragedy had anything to do with a TikTok craze. Archie's phone was still in his room.