£352 billion to convert UK homes to Heat Pumps

Redwurzel

Redwurzel

Well-known member
Newsnight said it costs £12,000 to convert an average UK property to a heat pump from a gas boiler. 29m properties need converting. They say that's £352bn yes billion not million. I imagine home owners will have pay some of that. But of if the Governement picked up 67% of the cost its still a big bill. It would cut our total carbon emissions by 20%.

What do board members think?
 
From the bits and pieces I have read (and that isn't exhaustive) the heat pump needs space for outdoor units, possible ground digging and a number of different sizable units in the home itself. That may pose significant issues in a large percentage of homes as a starter (street housing for example) is that factored in to this 'average'?

I appreciate there are different types and I am unable to determine which would be suitable for any of them, whether that affects costs significantly or indeed if the technology (at early stage - let's call it stage 1) cannot be reduced in size and thus deployment costs to make it more palatable? Are there any studies showing the potential technology improvements to make this less cumbersome?

We have to address the climate impact urgently, but technology has a habit of leaping ahead when you are in the throes of implementation...be good to look at the potentials before jumping in.
 
Heat pumps are big over here, and the technology is getting better all of the time, so you are getting slimmer units that can be wall mounted, although the heat pumps to run radiators etc, which we are looking at doing in our new build, are still chunky beasts.
 
NZBoro1 said:
Heat pumps are big over here, and the technology is getting better all of the time, so you are getting slimmer units that can be wall mounted, although the heat pumps to run radiators etc, which we are looking at doing in our new build, are still chunky beasts.
Click to expand...
They are indeed. In fact you can’t rent your property out these days without one. They are very good by the way.
 
Lots just like an air con unit.

It's where we are going to have to go though isn't it? We simply have to cut emissions and use less energy. Maybe there will be managed services where you "rent" the heat pump to help spread the cost? It's a lot of money to stump up in one go. There has to be a strategy on this, not just "we must have heat pumps"
 
I looked in to it when replacing my boiler earlier this year. The boiler cost me £2k and the heat pump was just going to be under £15k. A government scheme was in place but it involved me paying the £15k up front and then would receive a portion of it back over the next 7 years I think it was. If my memory is correct I would have got circa £12.5k back over this time.
 
I am looking at having to replace my boiler in the next few years. I was going to do it when I had my bathroom refurbished but I have taken the decision to wait and see what happens with heat pump technology. I believe there are two "sorts"; ground source, which requires earth works in your garden and air source which is basically an inverted air conditioner.

I think that in about five years new builds will not be fitted with gas boilers? After that I guess boilers will start to get more expensive as volumes drop and the prices of heat pumps comes down.
 
What do you do in cold temps? do you still need a separate heating system? I cant see them being much use in the winter months...which is when you need them the most
 
Youngie said:
What do you do in cold temps? do you still need a separate heating system? I cant see them being much use in the winter months...which is when you need them the most
Click to expand...
They are for cold temps, we get some pretty cold temps over here and they work well, but you've got to choose the right one
They stuck a lot of juice when they first start, but here they are used more as warm air generators, and use a ducting system in the loft (majority of homes over here are single story) to push warm air around the rooms
The one that we will get will heat up warm water to push around radiators, as we prefer central heating. Not that common over here, but it is getting fitted in more new homes now. Mate of mine is a central heating engineer over here, and that's the system he has. Will also do under floor heating.
The good thing about heat pumps us that they do also act as air cons, and if your electricity us generates sustainably then its winner winner chicken dinner
 
Lurching from one measure to the next.

Fundamentally, older houses are energy inefficient and much more needs to be done to help home owners make their homes retain the heat.

I recently sold my house and had a EPC from 5 years ago 1 point under a 'C' grade. As the boiler had been replaced with a high efficiency one, all new LED lights, better loft insulation and double glazing done since (what the EPC recommended). I thought I'd get a new EPC to get that higher grade, right?

No, the new EPC was 10 points lower, because of "criteria changes".

Basically the only things that would have improved the score cost well over £10000 each! On a £90k house.
 
Youngie said:
We need to see them in new builds as standard first I would think. once that duck is broken the market becomes more open to them and the supply chain adjusts to support them.

I really cant see it happening to the government target.
Click to expand...
This should be the starting point but it currently depends on developers doing this as I don't believe there is a current requirement / directive from planning or government.

One of the big issue is resilience in the electrical network and development viability.

If networks need upgrading to allow development of all electric homes (Inc car chargers etc) it's big money. Also the developer has to bear the cost of the initial increase in the cost of the heat pump technology.

I don't think rushing to retrofit old homes with heat pumps is the answer.
 
Redwurzel said:
Newsnight said it costs £12,000 to convert an average UK property to a heat pump from a gas boiler. 29m properties need converting. They say that's £352bn yes billion not million. I imagine home owners will have pay some of that. But of if the Governement picked up 67% of the cost its still a big bill. It would cut our total carbon emissions by 20%.

What do board members think?
Click to expand...
Wonder how many super energy efficient new builds £352 billion would build? I'd prefer more modern housing stock to be built with joint ownership etc. than trying to make a 1920's two up two down thermally efficient.

As has been said, this should be brought in on new builds and eased in over ten to twenty years.

I find it baffling that car emissions are absolutely hammered and are seen as a giant evil but the insulation and design of homes barely ever seems to change.
 
I agree with the comments on new builds shoud only be built with heat pumps. I would make that law in 12 months time or shorter if the industry can cope.

The pumps on Newsnight were outside in the back garden and were quite big, like a large air conditioning unit. They said they were problems because there were a shortage of people who could fit them. In they made it greater volume they said the price would come down. I can't see the price getting anywhere near say £2,000 for a fitted Gas boiler.

If the pumps need electricity as said there is going to enormous pressure put on the electricity grid with all cars being electric by around 2040. The first thing we should be doing is expanding the electricity generation capacity. At present with say Hinkley C nuclear station and planned wind/solar developments, we only seem to be replacing the old power stations that have shut down or about to shutdown. Is it unrealistic to say all new build should contain solar panels?
 
It's not going to happen until they go in new builds, and have been for a few years before we even think about existing homes, and we don't seem to be anywhere near that. There's no way they are going to get the public to for out 12k, or spend 12k in the hope of getting it back, it's just not going to happen.

Also, they're not meant to be great in old houses, with crap insulation, which is a lot of our houses. They're more suited to really cold, or warm climates, but I think from what I was reading our climate is pretty much the worst it could be for a heat pump, because of the humidity and potential for freezing, but not dry air? I've not read a lot on this mind, so could be talking crap.

Solar, batteries and electric heaters is my bet, until heat pumps become much cheaper or something else comes out.
 
Redwurzel said:
I agree with the comments on new builds shoud only be built with heat pumps. I would make that law in 12 months time or shorter if the industry can cope.

The pumps on Newsnight were outside in the back garden and were quite big, like a large air conditioning unit. They said they were problems because there were a shortage of people who could fit them. In they made it greater volume they said the price would come down. I can't see the price getting anywhere near say £2,000 for a fitted Gas boiler.

If the pumps need electricity as said there is going to enormous pressure put on the electricity grid with all cars being electric by around 2040. The first thing we should be doing is expanding the electricity generation capacity. At present with say Hinkley C nuclear station and planned wind/solar developments, we only seem to be replacing the old power stations that have shut down or about to shutdown. Is it unrealistic to say all new build should contain solar panels?
Click to expand...
It’s more a question of is it cost effective and is it a green decision to do so?

likewise the heat pumps as manufacturing a unit for every home in the country, plus scrapping the gas boilers, is a massive manufacturing program in itself, with regards to solar panels ive read they’re often not that green to produce as they produce waste during manufacturing and contain lead, cadmium etc

solar panels are expensive and would impact the housing market if suddenly you could afford 20k less house because of a requirement to have solar
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top