Will Starmer Sack Steve Reed?

[Alvez_48]

Unfortunate but a vote is ultimately earned isn't it.
The left and centre left could happily unite under the right leader it's nobodies fault that Keir so far isn't showing to be that leader. Maybe he will change, maybe he will get enough centre right voters. Good luck to him and everyone.

This is why labour will never win. If left won’t vote centre and the centre won’t vote left

 

[Chris_Boro]

Unfortunate but a vote is ultimately earned isn't it.
The left and centre left could happily unite under the right leader it's nobodies fault that Keir so far isn't showing to be that leader. Maybe he will change, maybe he will get enough centre right voters. Good luck to him and everyone.

There is no right leader when views are polerised. All any leader can do is play the their strength, something Jeremy Corbyn did but ultimately and unfortunately, was not successful.

 

[ForssAwakens]

There is no right leader when views are polerised. All any leader can do is play the their strength, something Jeremy Corbyn did but ultimately and unfortunately, was not successful.

They would have won 2017 if they mp’s themselves showed some unity. Instead they tried to oust corbyn and backfired big time

 

[Chris_Boro]

They would have won 2017 if they mp’s themselves showed some unity. Instead they tried to oust corbyn and backfired big time

I agree, I voted for Jeremy Corbyn and it annoys me greatly that labour shot itself in the foot for the selfish motives of certain MP's.

Right now, we need to unite around the common goal of winning the next election to get this lot out, Keir Starmer, like Jeremy Corbyn was elected leader and infighting must be put aside to achieve this.

 

[Billy Horner]

The purge of the left has been going on for a long time. Wadsworth and Walker were both kicked out of the party altogether for non anti-Semitism.
Chris Williamson was cleared of AS, reinstated and then kicked out again the next day for undisclosed reasons. To answer your question, Yes i do believe Starmer is also purging the left.

All three were expelled/suspended when Corbyn was leader, Formby was General Secretary and the NEC was heavily influenced by Unite and Momentum. Do you honestly believe they were 'purged' for being on the left?

 

[BlindBoyGrunt]

All three were expelled/suspended when Corbyn was leader, Formby was General Secretary and the NEC was heavily influenced by Unite and Momentum. Do you honestly believe they were 'purged' for being on the left?

Have you not heard anything about the leaked report? The party were expending great time and energy trawling social media and suspending Corbynite voters whilst ignoring the pile of anti-Semitism reports on the desk.

 

[festa5]

Meanwhile the Tories continue to run the country into the ground and move us ever further away from democracy.

I sympathise with Corbyn, I really do. Crucified by the media and a number of his own MPs briefing against him and undermining him at every turn. I can only assume they'd rather have seen a Tory government than a corbyn led Labour one. I'm still fuming about it. They're as culpable for the state of this country as anyone.

However the left of the party are just as bad now. Feels like it didn't matter who succeeded Corbyn, if it wasn't RLB they were going to be attacked by the left and accused of a purge etc. They have scores to settle and don't they forking let you know about it? They need to let it go because the Tories are probably ******* themselves at the state of all. It's pathetic.

The only thing that matters is getting those nobs out of power. It might not be in the form of a socialist nirvana some in the Labour party dream of, but unfortunately the electorate aren't ready for that yet. In the future maybe. But not now. And you can't make any change without being in power. So you either compromise, win an election and start to change things slowly or you stick to your principles, never have the opportunity to win an election and continue to moan like fork. I honestly think some on the left would rather just have a moan and feel good about themselves than have to compromise.

I voted for Labour under Corbyn. I will almost certainly vote Labour under Starmer. Because whatever you think of either of them, they're a million miles better than the alternative.

 

[hopesoboro]

Well quite a group from the far left voted far right in the last election so. you can never know what will happen next in Politics.

Explain, please.

 

[ForssAwakens]

Meanwhile the Tories continue to run the country into the ground and move us ever further away from democracy.

I sympathise with Corbyn, I really do. Crucified by the media and a number of his own MPs briefing against him and undermining him at every turn. I can only assume they'd rather have seen a Tory government than a corbyn led Labour one. I'm still fuming about it. They're as culpable for the state of this country as anyone.

However the left of the party are just as bad now. Feels like it didn't matter who succeeded Corbyn, if it wasn't RLB they were going to be attacked by the left and accused of a purge etc. They have scores to settle and don't they forking let you know about it? They need to let it go because the Tories are probably ******* themselves at the state of all. It's pathetic.

The only thing that matters is getting those nobs out of power. It might not be in the form of a socialist nirvana some in the Labour party dream of, but unfortunately the electorate aren't ready for that yet. In the future maybe. But not now. And you can't make any change without being in power. So you either compromise, win an election and start to change things slowly or you stick to your principles, never have the opportunity to win an election and continue to moan like fork. I honestly think some on the left would rather just have a moan and feel good about themselves than have to compromise.

I voted for Labour under Corbyn. I will almost certainly vote Labour under Starmer. Because whatever you think of either of them, they're a million miles better than the alternative.

The far left are a frustrating bunch, supposed to be tolerable and inclusive but they are more silo’d than then the right at times

 

[Duffman]

More troll anti labour click bait from BlindBillyGoat Gruff - where’s that ignore button?

 

[SuperStu]

unfortunately the electorate aren't ready for that yet. In the future maybe. But not now. And you can't make any change without being in power. So you either compromise, win an election and start to change things slowly

I think the problem for a lot of people on the left is that they just don't believe this is credible anymore. Blair and Brown had 13 years to pursue a slowly slowly agenda and it just never happened. Starmer needs to give people some reason to trust him that it'd be different with him.

 

[Laughing]

BBG is talking nonsense, I am not even convinced the tweet was posted to be anti-semetic, and yes your motives are important.

Once he realised that it could be considered offnsive it was removed. BTW I agree with the tweets sentiments, and I dont care whether the target was jewish or not.

 

[festa5]

I think the problem for a lot of people on the left is that they just don't believe this is credible anymore. Blair and Brown had 13 years to pursue a slowly slowly agenda and it just never happened. Starmer needs to give people some reason to trust him that it'd be different with him.

Yeah, that's probably part of it. And I've no problem with them having the debate and trying to move/keep the party further to the left. But it has to be done in the right way and they have to willing to compromise and give Starmer a chance. Part of that needs to be an acceptance that he has to try and keep the media onside a bit and certainly give them as little ammo as possible to use against labour.

And yes, the centrists absolutely did not do this under Corbyn. They need to get on board too and accept that a lot of the socialist policies were actually very popular and should be retained. As much as payback might be satisfying for the left it's not going to help anyone if the infighting continues.

 

[SuperStu]

And yes, the centrists absolutely did not do this under Corbyn. They need to get on board too and accept that a lot of the socialist policies were actually very popular and should be retained.

It's a bit like the prisoners dilemma. But one where the other prisoner has already very explicitly told you they have no intention of working together.

I still think, as I said on another thread last week, the left ought to follow the model set out by UKIP.

I.e.
1) Establish an extra-parliamentary, outrider party that can do/say things the media won't let Labour do/say.
2) Focus all attention on gaining public interest and support for 1 or 2 policy areas.
3) Threaten to split the vote forcing Labour's hand, to adopt the policies you want.
4) When Labour agree to adopt the policies you want, stand down in their key seats, giving them a free run.

unfortunately the electorate aren't ready for that yet

It's foolish to think the electorate will ever spontaneously/randomly/naturally be ready for left wing reforms to the economy. For there to be any chance of that shift in public perception happening, somebody has to be willing to make the case for it.

 

[Alvez_48]

Yeah, that's probably part of it. And I've no problem with them having the debate and trying to move/keep the party further to the left. But it has to be done in the right way and they have to willing to compromise and give Starmer a chance. Part of that needs to be an acceptance that he has to try and keep the media onside a bit and certainly give them as little ammo as possible to use against labour.

And yes, the centrists absolutely did not do this under Corbyn. They need to get on board too and accept that a lot of the socialist policies were actually very popular and should be retained. As much as payback might be satisfying for the left it's not going to help anyone if the infighting continues.

To be honest... The Tories are a completely spent outfit despite their majority.

If the next 4 years continues as it currently is under their leadership then Starmer will win on any platform he chooses, similar to Blair in the 90s.. people often forget that yes he was an excellent public performer but the conditions for his victory were laid by Major (unfairly from what I gather, it's before my era) and the Tories being deeply unpopular.

To your point it is satisfying to see people who 3 months ago couldn't vote for Corbyn leaping to Starmers defence. If you looked at it objectively he hasn't been a good leader thus far.