.


In fairness, all this tells you is that people would rather vote for Labour than the Tories. It doesn't tell you why yet we all know why. It is because Johnson and the Tories have driven away voters with their lying, rule-breaking, law-breaking even and people have become tired after 12 years of Tory rule that things are getting worse and not better.

Literally anyone (except maybe someone as divisive as Corbyn) would have similar numbers. Corbyn gets shat on but there are very few people that have inspired people to go out and vote for them and what they stand for rather than just their party. Nobody is voting for Starmer, he's just beige enough that he's not driving people away. If Sunak or Truss manage to convince enough people that they are not Johnson and can turn some voters back around then I can't see Starmer stopping them. People will vote Labour so the Tories lose. Hopefully enough to prevent another Tory government but it's hard to be optimistic about being ruled by Starmer because up to now he has offered nothing to be excited about.
 
In fairness, all this tells you is that people would rather vote for Labour than the Tories. It doesn't tell you why yet we all know why. It is because Johnson and the Tories have driven away voters with their lying, rule-breaking, law-breaking even and people have become tired after 12 years of Tory rule that things are getting worse and not better.

Literally anyone (except maybe someone as divisive as Corbyn) would have similar numbers. Corbyn gets shat on but there are very few people that have inspired people to go out and vote for them and what they stand for rather than just their party. Nobody is voting for Starmer, he's just beige enough that he's not driving people away. If Sunak or Truss manage to convince enough people that they are not Johnson and can turn some voters back around then I can't see Starmer stopping them. People will vote Labour so the Tories lose. Hopefully enough to prevent another Tory government but it's hard to be optimistic about being ruled by Starmer because up to now he has offered nothing to be excited about.
Id prefer to make a judgement nearer polling day and not now. We have 2 more years of this sh1tshow and 2 years as Truss as leader. If you think Truss or Sunak will turn it around I most certainly don't share your prediction. I can only see it getting much much worse, especially under the almost certain to be PM Truss. Labour's election manifesto is not out yet so will reserve judgement on Labour strategy until then
 
Id prefer to make a judgement nearer polling day and not now. We have 2 more years of this sh1tshow and 2 years as Truss as leader. If you think Truss or Sunak will turn it around I most certainly don't share your prediction. I can only see it getting much much worse, especially under the almost certain to be PM Truss. Labour's election manifesto is not out yet so will reserve judgement on Labour strategy until then
I don't think they will turn it around but Politics is a popularity contest so credibility and competence aren't needed to win an election. Sunak is a salesman. He can probably sell himself as different to the government he has been a part of and convince enough people to give him a chance.

I work off the assumption that the country skews to the right about 48:52. If everything is neutral then Tories win so Labour have to win those votes or the Tories have to scare them away. At present Labour would win because the Tories have scared enough away. All the new pm needs to do is distance themselves from the old regime's rule-breaking and then not be a disaster for 2 years and they could turn it back to neutral which would give them a win. They are also helped by the fact that the left is splintered.
 
I don't think they will turn it around but Politics is a popularity contest so credibility and competence aren't needed to win an election. Sunak is a salesman. He can probably sell himself as different to the government he has been a part of and convince enough people to give him a chance.

I work off the assumption that the country skews to the right about 48:52. If everything is neutral then Tories win so Labour have to win those votes or the Tories have to scare them away. At present Labour would win because the Tories have scared enough away. All the new pm needs to do is distance themselves from the old regime's rule-breaking and then not be a disaster for 2 years and they could turn it back to neutral which would give them a win. They are also helped by the fact that the left is splintered.
Your last sentence I certainly agree with.
 
I can't find that poll posted by Scrote from Savanta on their Twitter feed - its a screenshot but from where I don't know. In any case all the polls I have seen certainly do not have KS in "last place"
Savanta Poll for the Express

Table 17

And I'm largely not bothered by how people perform in polls. Was just the first thing I came across in response to MoltenAcori throwing a graph of the Labour Party into a conversation about Starmer.

I'd not be surprised at all if Starmer leads Labour to victory in the next election but I'd equally not be surprised in the slightest if he manages to lose it with the Tory attack largely concentrating on him (as the did with Corbyn).

We all want the Tories out but some of us want it more than others.
 
I don't think they will turn it around but Politics is a popularity contest so credibility and competence aren't needed to win an election. Sunak is a salesman. He can probably sell himself as different to the government he has been a part of and convince enough people to give him a chance.

I work off the assumption that the country skews to the right about 48:52. If everything is neutral then Tories win so Labour have to win those votes or the Tories have to scare them away. At present Labour would win because the Tories have scared enough away. All the new pm needs to do is distance themselves from the old regime's rule-breaking and then not be a disaster for 2 years and they could turn it back to neutral which would give them a win. They are also helped by the fact that the left is splintered.
Your last paragraph, whilst possibly correct does miss the point that governments are elected on about 500k swing voters. Those are, by and large, all the voters you need to "swing" to get a majority. I assume that Labour, and the tories for that matter, have targeted polling of the seats and personas that swing elections. This is information we just don't have.
 
Savanta Poll for the Express

Table 17

And I'm largely not bothered by how people perform in polls. Was just the first thing I came across in response to MoltenAcori throwing a graph of the Labour Party into a conversation about Starmer.

I'd not be surprised at all if Starmer leads Labour to victory in the next election but I'd equally not be surprised in the slightest if he manages to lose it with the Tory attack largely concentrating on him (as the did with Corbyn).

We all want the Tories out but some of us want it more than others.
Have had a look closely at that table 17 - You certainly had to dig deep to find it anyway.

So Table 17 is interesting. A small sample of 2000 respondents and if you look at the regions it comes up with this

56126323-93F7-4F41-A9A5-E549C47889F3.jpeg

So clearly there is a regional split of views. Scotland, Wales, NW, NE, Yorks and London Starmer holds up - NI, SW, SE and EM he doesn't so much. I acknowledge that with a deeply unpopular Government you'd expect Starmer to be further ahead but Truss is a new character and she will wear thin very quickly once she gets her feet under the table.
 
Have had a look closely at that table 17 - You certainly had to dig deep to find it anyway.

So Table 17 is interesting. A small sample of 2000 respondents and if you look at the regions it comes up with this

View attachment 41975

So clearly there is a regional split of views. Scotland, Wales, NW, NE, Yorks and London Starmer holds up - NI, SW, SE and EM he doesn't so much. I acknowledge that with a deeply unpopular Government you'd expect Starmer to be further ahead but Truss is a new character and she will wear thin very quickly once she gets her feet under the table.
It was shared (as that original tweet graphic) across left Twitter. I decided to go to the source to make sure there weren't any shenanigans. Even then it was only two clicks to get the document link.

Starmer has managed to make himself unpopular with the left and that will come to the fore closer to the election. It'll just be a re-hash of the Corbyn criticism (but in reverse). Your own party/people don't trust you.

The left need something/someone to rally behind and unfortunately Starmer is toxic. If Labour don't win the next election then no-one can say they weren't warned.
 
Looks like tonight's debate has got off to an exciting start.

(Kate McCann fainted apparently, but is okay).

 
Yes, he mentioned that. The Tories have only paid down four times in that period. Frightening to think the Tories have held power for that amount of time.
I know Murphy’s talked a lot about to whom the money is owed if most of it is actually ‘Created’ money, printed under instruction from the government. Can it in that case be technically considered as debt? Or as other people describe it…a con that government insist that ‘created’ money is a debt that must be paid back.
For a sovereign country with its own fiat currency (and a flexible exchange rate) then neither debts nor deficits matter per se, in the sense that they can always be financed, if the government is borrowing in its own currency. It has distributional effects but it's not like a household, a local council or a Euro member government running a deficit as it can create the thing it owes. Richard Murphy is very good on this (MMT)
 
Someone should ask them what they will do when the World King refuses to go see HM on Sept 5?

Bunter trying his utmost to go absolutely nowhere.
 
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