% of population dying from coronavirus ... pattern emerging

JM14 said:
Imagine there will be loads that dont even know they had it, makes it practically impossible to stop the spread once we ease lockdown.
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Exactly. Lockdown was brought in to "protect the NHS". That has been achieved. Time to craic on.
 
Chris_Boro said:
2.2 million extreamly vulnerable people dont share your optimism. Unless wider testing is brought in to establish the true numbers of asymtomatic people with the virus, we could be getting released into a blender.
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He's ignoring the reason lockdown was brought in - to Save Lives - unfortunately the government have put that to one side as well.
 
Chris_Boro said:
2.2 million extreamly vulnerable people dont share your optimism. Unless wider testing is brought in to establish the true numbers of asymtomatic people with the virus, we could be getting released into a blender.
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I was just relaying the government message Chris. We were told that locking down would flatten the curve, which has been achieved and protect the intensive care capacity of the NHS, which we have. ICU's around the country are currently running at about 15% capacity. In a bad flu season they run at 80% with no lockdown.
I'll say it again for the people in the back. Over the next 5 years I guarantee you this lockdown will be responsible for more deaths than covid-19 will be. We may even start seeing the effects of it as early as this time next year.

Chris, 2.2 million people are vulnerable to the flu and the common cold for example every year. Those illnesses haven't vanished.

I appreciate the sensible debate and conversation with you though.
 
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RandySavage said:
I was just relaying the government message Chris. We were told that locking down would flatten the curve, which has been achieved and protect the intensive care capacity of the NHS, which we have. ICU's around the country are currently running at about 15% capacity. In a bad flu season they run at 80% with no lockdown.
I'll say it again for the people in the back. Over the next 5 years I guarantee you this lockdown will be responsible for more deaths than covid-19 will be. We may even start seeing the effects of it as early as this time next year.

Chris, 2.2 million people are vulnerable to the flu and the common cold for example every year. Those illnesses haven't vanished.

I appreciate the sensible debate and conversation with you though.
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7000-40000 deaths prevented by lockdown, highly doubt the deaths caused by lockdown will be higher than that.


https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-53233974
 
RandySavage said:
I was just relaying the government message Chris. We were told that locking down would flatten the curve, which has been achieved and protect the intensive care capacity of the NHS, which we have. ICU's around the country are currently running at about 15% capacity. In a bad flu season they run at 80% with no lockdown.
I'll say it again for the people in the back. Over the next 5 years I guarantee you this lockdown will be responsible for more deaths than covid-19 will be. We may even start seeing the effects of it as early as this time next year.
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The Governments messages are sometimes best not repeated Randy. The only guarantee anyone can give is that more people will die directly and indirectly because of this pandemic. We are affected by decisions everyday of our lives. The trouble with your approach is it works relatively well for the young, fit, healthy and strong but shows a lack of care for the vulnerable, older, weaker members of society. Some would do well to think there but for the grace of god go I. One day if we are very lucky we will all fall into the elderly and vulnerable category through age alone. How would you feel if your health was compromised by younger generations In the future? Too many people only want to see things from their respective bubbles sadly.
 
coluka said:
The Governments messages are sometimes best not repeated Randy. The only guarantee anyone can give is that more people will die directly and indirectly because of this pandemic. We are affected by decisions everyday of our lives. The trouble with your approach is it works relatively well for the young, fit, healthy and strong but shows a lack of care for the vulnerable, older, weaker members of society. Some would do well to think there but for the grace of god go I. One day if we are very lucky we will all fall into the elderly and vulnerable category through age alone. How would you feel if your health was compromised by younger generations In the future? Too many people only want to see things from their respective bubbles sadly.
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Sensible post as usual from you corluka.
Advances in medical care means we are all living longer now than 100 years ago.
 
NYboro said:
Aren't you the lucky one. I know and know of plenty who have died from it and quite a number of those were in their 20s and 30s.
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In New York, or in the UK?

In the UK, the number of people aged between 1 and 54 who have died of Covid-19 in the UK is so small it doesn't show above the X axis on most charts.

There are a few deaths shown for people between 55 and 75, but beyond that, it's taken a terrible toll. The Excess Deaths chart for 2020 has now dipped below the 5 year average for June, so it's starting show that some of those people who died of Covid-19 would have died anyway, without Covid-19. If the trend continues, we'll be back to where we were in January 2020 by June 2021.
 
Soutra said:
In New York, or in the UK?

In the UK, the number of people aged between 1 and 54 who have died of Covid-19 in the UK is so small it doesn't show above the X axis on most charts.

There are a few deaths shown for people between 55 and 75, but beyond that, it's taken a terrible toll. The Excess Deaths chart for 2020 has now dipped below the 5 year average for June, so it's starting show that some of those people who died of Covid-19 would have died anyway, without Covid-19. If the trend continues, we'll be back to where we were in January 2020 by June 2021.
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The excess deaths were below the 5 year average in the months prior to the Covid-19 epidemic. People have died a horrific death from a nasty virus without their loved ones present and no trend will make up for that.
 
Soutra said:
In New York, or in the UK?

In the UK, the number of people aged between 1 and 54 who have died of Covid-19 in the UK is so small it doesn't show above the X axis on most charts.

There are a few deaths shown for people between 55 and 75, but beyond that, it's taken a terrible toll. The Excess Deaths chart for 2020 has now dipped below the 5 year average for June, so it's starting show that some of those people who died of Covid-19 would have died anyway, without Covid-19. If the trend continues, we'll be back to where we were in January 2020 by June 2021.
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That’s actually an incorrect standpoint, excess deaths this year had been tracking below the 5 years average before covid hit.

Deaths we’re below the 5 years average by 8 deaths which is hardly a point to say some of those who have died in excess would have died anyway
 
RandySavage said:
I was just relaying the government message Chris. We were told that locking down would flatten the curve, which has been achieved and protect the intensive care capacity of the NHS, which we have. ICU's around the country are currently running at about 15% capacity. In a bad flu season they run at 80% with no lockdown.
I'll say it again for the people in the back. Over the next 5 years I guarantee you this lockdown will be responsible for more deaths than covid-19 will be. We may even start seeing the effects of it as early as this time next year.

Chris, 2.2 million people are vulnerable to the flu and the common cold for example every year. Those illnesses haven't vanished.

I appreciate the sensible debate and conversation with you though.
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The problem lays with the government. They protected the NHS by kicking everyone out of it, leaving the elderly to die in care homes, cancelling potentially life saving operations and scared people away from A&E who should have gone. I feel I'm next inline to be pushed off a cliff, this time for the sake of protecting the economy.

We are being told to leave lockdown on the basis of evidence that is not complete (or hidden) and is not aligning with the science. Its easy to ignore the odds of catching the virus when those odds dont carry a potential death sentence.

2.2 million people, if a small fraction of those catch the virus, 10000s more people dead.

I agree that lockdown cant go on much longer, we are in the current knife-edge situation due to this governments failure to act quickly and their mismanagement of the crisis as a whole.

On the subject of flu, I get jabs every year, it does not spread as fast as C19 and its something we have lived with all our lives. We still do not understand the potential effects of C19 or how deadly it could be to the most vulnerable.

What will be a problem is when the young fit and healthy start to catch a cold and sneaze the coronavirus they dont know the have everywhere.
 
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I wonder what the appetite would be for a COVID approach to the flu/ common cold. Instead of going to work and out and about with symptoms a 7 day isolation was encouraged. If it weren't the oldest and most vulnerable dying of flu would this be normal practice?

Why do we disregard those deaths?

I am not suggesting we shut the economy for it, but this and the shut down and reopening of healthcare really makes you think how you value one condition/ life over another one.
 
Cambsred said:
I wonder what the appetite would be for a COVID approach to the flu/ common cold. Instead of going to work and out and about with symptoms a 7 day isolation was encouraged. If it weren't the oldest and most vulnerable dying of flu would this be normal practice?

Why do we disregard those deaths?

I am not suggesting we shut the economy for it, but this and the shut down and reopening of healthcare really makes you think how you value one condition/ life over another one.
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staying home rather than battling on and going to work spreading it should be one lesson we take from it.
 
GazC_MFC said:
That’s actually an incorrect standpoint, excess deaths this year had been tracking below the 5 years average before covid hit.

Deaths we’re below the 5 years average by 8 deaths which is hardly a point to say some of those who have died in excess would have died anyway
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It absolutely is the case that some of those people who died with Covid-19 would have died anyway, firstly because the vast majority had co-morbidities, and secondly because the vast majority were old. People don't live forever, especially those who have long standing illnesses.
 
Lefty said:
staying home rather than battling on and going to work spreading it should be one lesson we take from it.
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Hopefully we'll get rid of the appalling 'power through', 'man up' culture of people dragging themselves into work and then coughing and sneezing all over.

Workplace sickness policies will need to change as lots at the moment are designed to force people to come to work with cold/flu.
 
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