Not using substitutes

[Raul]

There are times though when it's so obvious what needs to be done. It was obvious McGree was struggling last night and should have come off much earlier for either Burgzorg or Conway.

Completely agree!

It’s what frustrates me so much when it’s clear and not done

Some games subs won’t be needed, some will need to be done at half time (Engel at Sheff Wed)

I think this is an area for Carrick that he needs to significantly improve, not just an arbitrary 60 min sub for example

 

[Ex Footy Legs]

Seems you are pretty angry about what’s going.
Not having a go btw - I get it.

Genuine question - does the venting on the Board help or would it be more helpful to take time away for a day or two?

I am angry, venting my opinion and why I think what I do helps.

That’s pretty much a Derby game for us last night and I do not mind getting beat but we we go down scrapping and fighting with every sinew I’ll clap them off but we went down with a whimper.

Add to that Carricks team. Mcgree hasn’t played for 3-4 weeks and to throw him in against Leeds away.
What was Carrick thinking?
Clarke looked rusty too and we needed experience last night and I’d of picked Ayling and howson and burgzorg leaving out Mcgree , barlassor and dijksteel.
Giving mcgree at least 30 minutes at the end.

I think Carrick is really lost with all this rotation, I think he thinks he’s at Man City. Arrogant and doesn’t want to acknowledge players limitations and it’s costing us.
If he walked away tomorrow it wouldn’t bother me.
We need a team with more steel and more leadership and he really doesn’t understand.

I’ve been saying it since game 10, we are going nowhere fast with Carrick

 

[Bruciebonus]

There are times though when it's so obvious what needs to be done. It was obvious McGree was struggling last night and should have come off much earlier for either Burgzorg or Conway.

Completely agree, what's infuriating is you can see a change is needed, Carrick tries to ride it out, the opposition score then he reacts and makes the change he should have made 15/20 minutes earlier.

I thought McGree didn't look match fit, wouldn't have been surprised if he was subbed at half-time, 60 mins max. He was left on until he lost the ball for the second goal, then lost it twice more after that, then he was eventually hooked on 80 mins. Stable, door, bolted, etc.

 

[Ex Footy Legs]

Completely agree, what's infuriating is you can see a change is needed, Carrick tries to ride it out, the opposition score then he reacts and makes the change he should have made 15/20 minutes earlier.

I thought McGree didn't look match fit, wouldn't have been surprised if he was subbed at half-time, 60 mins max. He was left on until he lost the ball for the second goal, then lost it twice more after that, then he was eventually hooked on 80 mins. Stable, door, bolted, etc.

This is all from a manager the majority on here drool over.
I think he’s an overrated wannabe with woodgate next to him and we all know he’s a complete numpty unless he’s playing but…oops he’s retired.
Leeds weren’t good last night and were there for the taking but yet again under this, so called arrogant manager, we fall well short of expectations

 

[uncle_rico]

If we had a couple of Pearson / Leadbitter experienced Champo battlers / leaders on the bench it'd maybe be more of an option to close games out.

We had Howson and Ayling on the bench last night. And Jones. All experienced championship players. All stayed on the bench.

 

[Caesium137]

We had Howson and Ayling on the bench last night. And Jones. All experienced championship players. All stayed on the bench.

Whilst I get what you're saying they're not the calibre players I'm talking about,

Howson has looked like he's gone a season too far at times and doesn't seem fully fit either.

Ayling probably falls more into that category, but again is on the wind down and again hasn't been in great form.

Jones has stunk the place out in many of his appearances this season, and although he has plenty of games in the Champo with us, he was a punt from non-league.

I'm talking more players of the Crooks, Mowatt & Edmondson age/physique, but a bit more influential / steady headed.

We lack a bit of nastiness, nous, game management, experience IMO. I strongly believe we'd have a decent handful more points if we'd had that.

 

[Laughing]

Monday morning quaterbacking. After a loss it's all hindsight. We never hear this after a win.

 

[Bruciebonus]

This is all from a manager the majority on here drool over.
I think he’s an overrated wannabe with woodgate next to him and we all know he’s a complete numpty unless he’s playing but…oops he’s retired.
Leeds weren’t good last night and were there for the taking but yet again under this, so called arrogant manager, we fall well short of expectations

I think Kieran Scott has given Carrick some good players to work with and I assume he spends a fair bit of time coaching them on the training pitch. Mowbray mentioned in his commentary during the Luton game that 'Middlesbrough look a well drilled team' which is great. But if plan A stops working for whatever reason, I'm not seeing a plan B?

In game management seems to be a bit of a blind spot with Carrick, he could do with some experience along side him. Because either he's not receiving that advise or if he is he's not listening to it. The only person I see speaking with him during the game is Woodgate (as you've mentioned).

 

[Soutra]

It’s an obvious factor that Carrick is slow and reluctant to use substitutes. Statistics show that we are the worst team in the division for conceding late goals. Of the 25 goals we have conceded this season 12 have been in last 20 minutes. Plymouth (23rd in the table) equal us, and Cardiff (22nd) are next with 10 goals conceded.
Surely this isn’t a coincidence?

I'm not quite so sure it's that cut and dried.

Championship - Goal time statistics

Goals scored and conceded per 15 minutes in English Championship

www.soccerstats.com

Goal timings do suggest Carrick does change things at half time and that Boro concede late goals chasing the game - like against Leeds and Coventry. But Boro score late goals too - so not all bad.

 

[Chemicalworker]

Watching Carrick stood with Woodgate, not having a clue what to do in the late second half was not a surprise.
We see it so often.

Ah you’re back

 

[Defender 4x4]

MC and his very poor back room staff will never get us promoted. We need a total change of the management.

 

[WilliamMunny]

I think it’s a blind spot for some Boro fans when it comes to substitutions. Have a look at the elite managers and you’ll see it’s rare for them to make subs early on in games. Tonight Pep made 2 late subs but only after going 2-0 down.

 

[sherlock]

MC and his very poor back room staff will never get us promoted. We need a total change of the management.

Dear me, get a grip.

 

[BoroMad87]

It’s an obvious factor that Carrick is slow and reluctant to use substitutes. Statistics show that we are the worst team in the division for conceding late goals. Of the 25 goals we have conceded this season 12 have been in last 20 minutes. Plymouth (23rd in the table) equal us, and Cardiff (22nd) are next with 10 goals conceded.
Surely this isn’t a coincidence?

This is a frustrating one for me, Carrick constantly bangs on about protecting players when returning from Injuries etc, but when watching the game and seeing that a player is flat on his feet after 60 minutes, not a bad thing he still doesn't make a sub, I appreciate timing and game management etc play a major factor but all of his subs always feel too little to late.

 

[Laughing]

I would imagine the players are monitored and that data is used to decide whether a player needs to come off because he is "dead on his feet" rather than a fans damp finger on the air

 

[Ex Footy Legs]

I would imagine the players are monitored and that data is used to decide whether a player needs to come off because he is "dead on his feet" rather than a fans damp finger on the air

You would 'imagine' but you are not sure that data is used to determine how tired a player is ?

I would be amazed if such definitive data is used to ratify a decision to remove a player from the pitch - the age old - nous and experience is enough but Carrick doesn't have that 'nose' for subs unfortunately, and let's be honest with ourselves, Woodgate, from the evidence we have, doesn't have it AT ALL. He nearly took us to league 1 - I will never forget how we were devoid of anything under him - weeks later - Warnock arrived with some proper experience of just managing people and organising a team basically transformed the same group that Woodgate had looking like numpties.
Woodgate is stood alongside Carrick now. Great!
For me, Carrick doesn't know, what he doesn't know. (what does that mean ?) Well, he doesn't understand his blind spots.....the best managers and CEO's bring in people often more intelligent than them - I think Carrick keeps Woodgate here because he is 'one of our own'

All I remember about Woodgate is he nearly destroyed us with his inept management. No room for sentiment if someone is inadequate.
Carrick's blind spots are linked to his arrogance or 'superiority complex' given he played for the champions then he gets 'carte blanche' to do what he pleases without challenge.

Sorry but i see right through the façade but so many hang off his every word.....jeez...

 

[Laughing]

You would 'imagine' but you are not sure that data is used to determine how tired a player is ?

I would be amazed if such definitive data is used to ratify a decision to remove a player from the pitch - the age old - nous and experience is enough but Carrick doesn't have that 'nose' for subs unfortunately, and let's be honest with ourselves, Woodgate, from the evidence we have, doesn't have it AT ALL. He nearly took us to league 1 - I will never forget how we were devoid of anything under him - weeks later - Warnock arrived with some proper experience of just managing people and organising a team basically transformed the same group that Woodgate had looking like numpties.
Woodgate is stood alongside Carrick now. Great!
For me, Carrick doesn't know, what he doesn't know. (what does that mean ?) Well, he doesn't understand his blind spots.....the best managers and CEO's bring in people often more intelligent than them - I think Carrick keeps Woodgate here because he is 'one of our own'

All I remember about Woodgate is he nearly destroyed us with his inept management. No room for sentiment if someone is inadequate.
Carrick's blind spots are linked to his arrogance or 'superiority complex' given he played for the champions then he gets 'carte blanche' to do what he pleases without challenge.

Sorry but i see right through the façade but so many hang off his every word.....jeez...

Ex footy I can't be bothered pulling that apart, it won't make a jot of difference to your opinion so there isn't really any point.

 

[BoroPhil]

This is all from a manager the majority on here drool over.
I think he’s an overrated wannabe with woodgate next to him and we all know he’s a complete numpty unless he’s playing but…oops he’s retired.
Leeds weren’t good last night and were there for the taking but yet again under this, so called arrogant manager, we fall well short of expectations

This just isn't true is it? Leeds played very well and had won 6 in a row at home, not conceding for almost 2 months. Probably the exact opposite of there for the taking.

The meltdown from some on here after losing a game we were expected to lose is quite impressive.

 

[Ex Footy Legs]

Ex footy I can't be bothered pulling that apart, it won't make a jot of difference to your opinion so there isn't really any point.

That's fair enough - Look at my post though about Jones and how Doak is the same type of player to how jones was at the beginning when Jones burst onto the scene under Warnock - running onto the ball....that's his game (Jones) and Doak is exactly the same ; BUT (!) Doak is getting the ball to feet all the time and he is slowly being found out because he needs a mix of situations to make an impact but the majority of the time he's just getting the ball to feet.
Watch Doak's form start to fade. Heading down the same route and Jones.

 

[Ex Footy Legs]

This just isn't true is it? Leeds played very well and had won 6 in a row at home, not conceding for almost 2 months. Probably the exact opposite of there for the taking.

The meltdown from some on here after losing a game we were expected to lose is quite impressive.

Winning 6 in a ow has nothing to do with what we all watched the other night. Doak fluffed a chance to put us 1-2 up and Leeds were not battering us - we were causing our own problems that Leeds inevitably took advantage of - eventually.