McBrid
Well-known member
Of course it is a ridiculous rule. Who said it wasn’t? Stop picking a bit of by comment to digest it into something else. My point was to do with VAR, not the stupid handball rule.
Newcastle penalty...
- Thread starter ChrisTheRed
- Start date
Of course it is a ridiculous rule. Who said it wasn’t? Stop picking a bit of by comment to digest it into something else. My point was to do with VAR, not the stupid handball rule.
tripleheader
Well-known member
One of FIFA's governing principles is to promote integrity and fairness within the game of football. Hmm I give you Sepp Blatter and the awarding of World Cups etc. VAR and it's miss-use, how it has ruined the fluidity of this game. Along with this stupid handball rule.
We seriously need to effect change at FIFA if not to have a Brexit vote, do an 'American' and have our own version of 'World Series of Football' under proper football rules. Yes the continentals have brought some wonderful skills to the game, but also some horrible cheats, behaviour and rules none of us want to see in the game.
We seriously need to effect change at FIFA if not to have a Brexit vote, do an 'American' and have our own version of 'World Series of Football' under proper football rules. Yes the continentals have brought some wonderful skills to the game, but also some horrible cheats, behaviour and rules none of us want to see in the game.
Heam44
Well-known member
VAR should be used in 2 situations.
1. If the VAR ref spots an absolute shocker I.e Maradona hand of god goal / Henry handball against Ireland etc.
2. If the on pitch referee decides he wants to have a look at the pitch side camera (whether that because he missed an off the ball incident / wants to see another angle / needs and second glance etc)
It’s ridiculous not to use the technology that’s available but we need to ‘keep it simple’.
That’s just my opinion, but I’m sure everyone agrees - it’s bloody good one
1. If the VAR ref spots an absolute shocker I.e Maradona hand of god goal / Henry handball against Ireland etc.
2. If the on pitch referee decides he wants to have a look at the pitch side camera (whether that because he missed an off the ball incident / wants to see another angle / needs and second glance etc)
It’s ridiculous not to use the technology that’s available but we need to ‘keep it simple’.
That’s just my opinion, but I’m sure everyone agrees - it’s bloody good one
Scrote
Well-known member
The stupid handball rule that only exists because of VAR..?
sambaDTR
Well-known member
Evidently, according to MOTD2 tonight it is a FIFA rule. Last year the Spanish and Italian leagues followed it and there were nearly 50 penalties for handball compared to 16 in the PL! Ridiculous rule. The PL (Managers, Players etc) and yes US, should tell them to get stuffed.
Expat Smoggie
Well-known member
I just don't understand why they'd want to enact a rule such as that? What's the point of it? Anyone [expert] know?
festa5
Well-known member
In theory VAR should be a positive tool. The problem is that the game is run by idiots in suits who often haven't kicked a ball for years, if ever. The handball rule is insane, but any player, fan, manager or ref could have told you that.
Used sparingly in specific circumstances VAR should be fine. Lots of ways that could have been done. Instead they've tried to use it for almost everything from the start and that has caused problems. Rather than wind it back a bit they've doubled down on those problems by changing the rules to try and accommodate it. VAR should be helping to enforce the rules. The rules aren't there to support VAR. It's mental.
There should have been a proper consultation done on the application of VAR taking into account the views of fans, clubs etc. Of course that takes time, effort and money. And we know most of the senior people in FIFA are there for reasons that have little to do with competence.
Used sparingly in specific circumstances VAR should be fine. Lots of ways that could have been done. Instead they've tried to use it for almost everything from the start and that has caused problems. Rather than wind it back a bit they've doubled down on those problems by changing the rules to try and accommodate it. VAR should be helping to enforce the rules. The rules aren't there to support VAR. It's mental.
There should have been a proper consultation done on the application of VAR taking into account the views of fans, clubs etc. Of course that takes time, effort and money. And we know most of the senior people in FIFA are there for reasons that have little to do with competence.
Cardiffdaffs
Well-known member
If accidental handball is now an offence you are going to get strikers aiming the ball at the hands of defenders. Cyclical view but it will be an inevitable conssequence sadly.
The new rule change to the handball law does give the referee some leeway when it states if the defender cannot see the ball They can be given the benefit of doubt and surely the referee in the Spurs v Newcastle game could have interpreted the Dier “handball” in that way and not given it.
The new rule change to the handball law does give the referee some leeway when it states if the defender cannot see the ball They can be given the benefit of doubt and surely the referee in the Spurs v Newcastle game could have interpreted the Dier “handball” in that way and not given it.
Marvanelli
Well-known member
Got to admit, I found it hilarious on Jose.
Spurs will be raging at the decision (rightly so), however, they had ample opportunities to put that game to bed.
They should've been 4/5-0 up before the penalty decision and they can only blame themselves for that decision costing them 2 points.
Spurs will be raging at the decision (rightly so), however, they had ample opportunities to put that game to bed.
They should've been 4/5-0 up before the penalty decision and they can only blame themselves for that decision costing them 2 points.
It's crap, but it should even out. They probably shouldn't give them within a few yards mind, as it's impossible for players to react in time to try and avoid it or try and intentionally stop it. But they you have the argument of how far is a few yards, it's tough, where does the line get drawn? There does need to be a line though, as the howlers and cheating are 20 times worse.
Anyone suggesting strikers or players crossing the ball will aim for a players hand, rather than aiming for their target is being silly.
It's hard enough to hit the target, or pick out a man, what chance do they have of hitting someone's hand versus losing the ball?
I can just see it now:
Manager: "You squared the ball to four of their defenders and keeper, rather than trying to cut it back to your striker?"
Crosser: "I was trying to kick it at the defenders hand guv"
Manager: "But it's a an area 1/3rd of the ball size, 10 yards away from you?"
Striker: "You can't hit a barn door lad, never mind some guys arm"
Manager: "Sub, get warmed up and show this to$$er how to play football"
Crosser: "But gov...."
Manager: "It's the 5th time you've done it lad, and you missed each one, and they scored three counter attacks from it"
Fan1: "that crosser is ****, he's not picked his man out all day"
Fan2: "maybe he was trying to hit the defenders hand?"
Fan1: "don't be so f-ing stupid"
Anyone suggesting strikers or players crossing the ball will aim for a players hand, rather than aiming for their target is being silly.
It's hard enough to hit the target, or pick out a man, what chance do they have of hitting someone's hand versus losing the ball?
I can just see it now:
Manager: "You squared the ball to four of their defenders and keeper, rather than trying to cut it back to your striker?"
Crosser: "I was trying to kick it at the defenders hand guv"
Manager: "But it's a an area 1/3rd of the ball size, 10 yards away from you?"
Striker: "You can't hit a barn door lad, never mind some guys arm"
Manager: "Sub, get warmed up and show this to$$er how to play football"
Crosser: "But gov...."
Manager: "It's the 5th time you've done it lad, and you missed each one, and they scored three counter attacks from it"
Fan1: "that crosser is ****, he's not picked his man out all day"
Fan2: "maybe he was trying to hit the defenders hand?"
Fan1: "don't be so f-ing stupid"
My hope was that VAR would be an additional tool for the officials to use when further clarity was needed, not to entirely replace decision making in these circumstances. I think I preferred it more when occasionally decisions were made incorrectly, rather than this sanitised, literal interpretation of the rules
For me that decision was not ideal, but I think it's fairer and simpler to go to the letter of the law, every time, rather than half the time, or none of the time, there's three choices:
1) Always VAR - Give Newcastle the pen (which did hit the hand, and seemed to be heading towards other players/ the goal), but also stop some blatant missed howler
2) Some VAR - Hard to implement, as the line needs drawing somewhere, where?
3) No VAR - Don't give Newcastle the pen, but also fail to stop some howler on the line
I would prefer 2, but it's difficult to implement. But my next choice is 1, as I don't want the howler missed, and that's worth more than being overly penal on other decisions.
Overall, the amount of correct offsides, handballs, fouls has gone up drastically, which is great, but the amount of penal decisions has too, not so great, but in my opinion it's worth the latter to get the former.
One thing I don't like is the speed it takes to do the reviews. For me, I think I would prefer a quick reaction panel of three refs in a studio for howlers, for the higher level premiership, internationals and European games, just three quick votes in 5 seconds, then move on. For lower level, just have one guy if it saves cost, or maybe just have 2-3 reviews per game.
DCI_Gene_Hunt
Well-known member
Its not the refereeing its the rules they have to implement and the use of VAR as dictated by FIFA.
HolgateCorner
Well-known member
Yes but it will be the refereeing fraternity who contribute to the rule making and they seem to have no idea how to communicate to players, managers and fans why the rules exist or the interpretation of them. The good refs have always been good communicators. VAR is not the problem in my view, it is how it is being used.
As for the QPR match ref no technical excuse for his ‘mistake’ which means you start to wonder about his motivations.
DCI_Gene_Hunt
Well-known member
Your last sentence referring to VAR is exactly what I said!
Referees make "mistakes" in all matches. Presumably you are then questioning the motivations of all referees in all matches?
HolgateCorner
Well-known member
No, I think the QPR ref may have been bent or at the very least incompetent but I don’t think all refs are bent or incompetent, some make genuine mistakes and that’s human error.
My point with VAR is a different one in that the refs effectively set the rules, so if the rules are a mess like in the Spurs match then it rests with the refs as a collective body to sort out their own mess.
DCI_Gene_Hunt
Well-known member
You couldn't be more wrong.
IFAB set the rules of the game.
https://www.theifab.com/overview/overview
Boro Devonport
Well-known member
What a bizarre out of touch comment. There is less drama at the theatre. Its why football is a billion pound industry. Go figure. Drama for hundreds of thousands of Newcastle and Spurs fans facing an agonising wait. Drama for the 22 players after 90 minutes of sporting effort. Plenty of drama in both manager's interviews? No? Astonishing narcissistic comment completely ignoring those involved in a competitive game.
Rofesleg
Well-known member
England, Ireland, Scotland and Wales get one vote each and the rest if the world get 4 between them? How did that come about?
Rofesleg
Well-known member
Mind you, if 6 votes are needed then only changes that Fifa agree with will get through anyway, though 3 of the home nations could block it