Les Ferdinand on why QPR players didn’t take a knee on Friday

B_G said:
And roofie, you think football matches are the place for this flashpoint?
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To assert their is no place for "politics" in sport is being complicit in the denial of institutionalised racism in Football.
To avoid upsetting the fascists is to be compicit in their violence, ignorance and thuggery.

Racism is part of our society. It is part of the fabric of the society we live in. Sport and all human activity is inextricably linked in "society".
Our society is predicated on systemic inequality and breeds division to maintain it.
Divide and rule.
When we are fighting each other, we are not raising our eyes to the elite manipulating the strings.

Apartheid South Africa tried the "sportswash" arguement when the Springbok teams attempted to tour abroad and invite other countries to "compete" in their racist empire.
Rhodesia - after Ian smith declared UDI attempted the same sportswashing - but it didnt work.
Israel are trying the same tactic - inviting pop stars and sports teams to play in the occupied territories - it legitimises their racism

Dont fall into the trap.
Black Lives Matter because they are killed for being black.

The struggle against inequality begins in our heads and is demonstrtated in our actions.

Pastor Martin Niemoller wrote:
First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a socialist.​
Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a trade unionist.​
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew.​
Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.​
 
Piccadilly Day Tripper said:
The view that sport is just a form of entertainment and that politics and culture don't push through is really naive. Why you go to the game, why certain fans or players excite you or rile you up, why FA Cup stories of part time teams or clubs fallen on hard times having a good run grab the attention, are all entangled in the politics of the region, the politics of the country - and with states now buying our biggest clubs to build their own reputation and distract, its the politics of the world too.

If people just wanted to go to the game and get away from the stresses of life, we'd still be watching football in crumbling stadiums.

I'm not sure about the continued taking of the knee. I think Ferdinand's point about it becoming another empty gesture in place of actual action is solid, and of course the situation in the US is completely different to the UK. But as long as black players (and players from other ethnic backgrounds) have to contend with some atrocious racism directed at them, doing a job they have worked all their life for, inside stadiums, on social media, comments sections on newspaper articles, messageboards - though not this one I'm pleased to say - for me they can do whatever they like to jolt a change in behaviour and attitude in those who come to watch the game for the love of the sport. I'll back them.


Stick Football Against The Enemy on your Christmas list - https://www.amazon.co.uk/Football-Against-Enemy-Simon-Kuper/dp/0752848771 - its a great read, even though its 26 year old.
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It is a brilliant book
 
NoloBoro said:
There are bigger issues than this in the world surely. The ‘man’ is quite happy for us to debate all this while he screws us all.
in my opinion we won’t conquer race inequality until we stop thinking of ourselves as different.
however, can’t we just have football back ffs. Don’t want a lesson in morality every time I watch a sport.
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There are bigger issues than this in the world, says the white guy hwo isn't on the end of racism
 
smogontherhine said:
Have you ever stopped for a second to think about how many that kneel actually care and how many are doing it through societal pressure ?
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yes, I have. Maybe those that haven't previously shown any care about the politics of racism will have a moments thought, about their team mates and what they have to put up with, as they take that knee....but no one is forcing them.
 
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B_G said:
And roofie, you think football matches are the place for this flashpoint?
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football has been a place for political statements many times, it is also a place where racism has been a breeding ground, so it's exactly the place to point out that those people you support, some of them are black too.

I've heard people shouting racist abuse at the opposition, then two mins later applauding Ehiogu and Boateng. Racism really is the language of the stupid
 
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B_G said:
When I turn on the TV or attend a match, it is my time to relax and enjoy some sport, get away from other stresses in life etc. It is a form of entertainment.
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That's definitely not how I see it. Sounds more like a soap opera or a comedy panel show. To me, professional sport isn't entertainment being put on for people, it's a competitive contest. Hence all the levels in the league pyramid. These contests should be happening whether or not anyone turns up to watch.

Besides, what sort of nutcase tunes in to Boro matches to relax?
 
r00fie1 said:
To assert their is no place for "politics" in sport is being complicit in the denial of institutionalised racism in Football.
To avoid upsetting the fascists is to be compicit in their violence, ignorance and thuggery.

Racism is part of our society. It is part of the fabric of the society we live in. Sport and all human activity is inextricably linked in "society".
Our society is predicated on systemic inequality and breeds division to maintain it.
Divide and rule.
When we are fighting each other, we are not raising our eyes to the elite manipulating the strings.

Apartheid South Africa tried the "sportswash" arguement when the Springbok teams attempted to tour abroad and invite other countries to "compete" in their racist empire.
Rhodesia - after Ian smith declared UDI attempted the same sportswashing - but it didnt work.
Israel are trying the same tactic - inviting pop stars and sports teams to play in the occupied territories - it legitimises their racism

Dont fall into the trap.
Black Lives Matter because they are killed for being black.

The struggle against inequality begins in our heads and is demonstrtated in our actions.

Pastor Martin Niemoller wrote:
First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a socialist.​
Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a trade unionist.​
Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew.​
Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.​
Click to expand...

Ah, propagandising again Roofie.... as you seem to be fond of second-hand soundbites, quotes & phrases I'll give you another one....

A little learning is a dangerous thing;
drink deep, or taste not the Pierian spring:
there shallow draughts intoxicate the brain,
and drinking largely sobers us again.
 
BoroMart said:
your attitude to this subject, are you telling me otherwise or just using anonymity to try and to back up your argument?
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Which argument do you refer to? Was not aware I was arguing? Merely engaged in a debate. Tell me why would my race determine my though process on this. I am incidentally white but from a mixed race family does that make my opinion more or less valid on the subject? Do my views not matter because they differ from yours? There are bigger issues than race at the moment. Social mobility, child poverty to name two, I could go on.
 
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