Keir Starmers speech

Apparently Nandy was on Politics Live earlier saying Labour are dropping the polices for higher top rate of income tax and nationalisation. :rolleyes:(y)

I guess that's what this bit is all about:

Lefty said:
The lesson is don’t look back, look to the future.

We need to be thinking about the questions of 2024 and the 2030s, not the questions of the past.

If anything, Covid has quickened the pace.

The challenges we now face mean that even the questions of 2019 already seem like ancient history.

What we say at the next general election isn’t written yet. But it will be rooted in Labour values.

It won’t sound like anything you’ve heard before. It will sound like the future arriving.'
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dooderooni said:
It'd be stupid to reveal exact policy at this point because if it gained support from the public then it'd be incorporated into the Tory manifesto.
He's not enough of a socialist for me, but if he can get rid of this current mob of self-serving mobsters and start to change the national dialogue to a fairer and more equitable one then he'll do for me.
It might be a long journey to reach where I think we'd be a better nation, but we have to start that journey away from the rush to the right and I think he can do that.
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Correct, the next GE is what 4 years away, plenty of time for sabotage attempts.

Re being socialist enough. You're not going to get a socialist government in power. For Labour to win a GE you need to be more towards the centre. The last 20 years and the era of digital has enabled so many people to launch their own business and the number of private sector businesses has almost doubled in that time. For Labour to win a GE they need to tick the boxes of those people (myself included), for me Keir Starmer does that, something JC couldn't do. He's professional and statesman like in his persona, as a refreshing change to BJ.
 
Lefty said:
"As well as anger, I feel frustration that every Labour Party spokesperson is a shadow. Shadow Education. Shadow Health. Shadow Chancellor. Shadow Foreign. Until we come out of the shadows, this party can’t change anything"

“I can see in my mind’s eye the country I want us to be; properly funded universal public services”

"Whilst Boris Johnson was writing flippant columns about bendy bananas, I was defending victims and prosecuting terrorists."
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I haven’t voted labour for years but this fella might change that. I didn’t like his ridiculous brexit policy but that aside he is far and away the most impressive labour leader that I can remember.
 
Jostler said:
Correct, the next GE is what 4 years away, plenty of time for sabotage attempts.

Re being socialist enough. You're not going to get a socialist government in power. For Labour to win a GE you need to be more towards the centre. The last 20 years and the era of digital has enabled so many people to launch their own business and the number of private sector businesses has almost doubled in that time. For Labour to win a GE they need to tick the boxes of those people (myself included), for me Keir Starmer does that, something JC couldn't do. He's professional and statesman like in his persona, as a refreshing change to BJ.
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I'm one of these weirdos who believes that socialism is more of a mental attitude than about forcible policy.
Affordable housing, health care, equality and all the other things we're told we can't afford are affordable if you have the will to do so.
Paying your fair share of tax is seen as a punishment and something to be avoided currently. With a socialist attitude you understand the difference it can make to others, even if you don't have cause to use the services it funds. Socialism shouldn't preclude entrepreneurs or small businesses, it in fact needs them as an essential part of a better society.
 
Starmer is a man who seems to understand the concept of the overton window.

I didn't mind Corbyn. I think he is a good man but his naivety drove me up the wall. Liked his policies, and I'm definitely more of a socialist than anything else. But you have to be realistic and compromise if you want to be in power. You have to be in power to change things. It's as simple as that.

There's maybe an argument that it sounds like Starmer is compromising too much perhaps. But I think he probably has to play it as mainstream as possible for now so your general punter can see there's a difference between him and bogeyman Corbyn.

Corbyn refused to compromise at all. And that was a key problem.
 
In politics political paragons are nothing without power and Starmer is pragmatic enough to realise that, the shift left that Corbyn’s leadership brought means that whilst moving central Starmer still comes from a position that is left of Blair, Brown and Miliband, a decent balance of centralist soft capitalism but with a significant membership and representation of the retrospective left that is the Corbyn legacy, a Labour Party needs the floating centrist votes but can not afford to alienate those on the more Socialist wing of the political spectrum.

The next step is re-establishment in Scotland and Wales an identity as the party of the provinces that Labour has lost over the last decade and define a European policy that will satisfy both sides of the Brexit debate.

Reliance on the failure and incompetence of others should not be enough, policies and ideas that are recognised as been valuable in their own right and will create opportunity for betterment for all, Labour for too long has been seen as creators of a glass ceiling of achievement and that belief needs to be changed to show it’s about raising standards at the bottom and not punishing those at the top.

I think Starmer is an asset to the Labour Party and has been quietly impressive under difficult circumstances in his leadership so far, but he needs to continue to grow into the role and show the electorate how a proper statesman should act and build that trust so they accept the workability of Labour policy in any future election.
 
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American_Mary said:
In politics political paragons are nothing without power and Starmer is pragmatic enough to realise that, the shift left that Corbyn’s leadership brought means that whilst moving central Starmer still comes from a position that is left of Blair, Brown and Miliband, a decent balance of centralist soft capitalism but with a significant membership and representation of the retrospective left that is the Corbyn legacy, a Labour Party needs the floating centrist votes but can not afford to alienate those on the more Socialist wing of the political spectrum.

The next step is re-establishment in Scotland and Wales an identity as the party of the provinces that Labour has lost over the last decade and define a European policy that will satisfy both sides of the Brexit debate.

Reliance on the failure and incompetence of others should not be enough, policies and ideas that are recognised as been valuable in their own right and will create opportunity for betterment for all, Labour for too long has been seen as creators of a glass ceiling of achievement and that belief needs to be changed to show it’s about raising standards at the bottom and not punishing those at the top.

I think Starmer is an asset to the Labour Party and has been quietly impressive under difficult circumstances in his leadership so far, but he needs to continue to grow into the role and show the electorate how a proper statesman should act and build that trust so they accept the workability of Labour policy in any future election.
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I think this speech shows he knows this. Like Blair, he is a strategic thinker. Johnson and his cabinet are the opposite. Many of the power brokers behind the Tories are strategic, but they only back winners.
 
Lefty said:
I think this speech shows he knows this. Like Blair, he is a strategic thinker. Johnson and his cabinet are the opposite. Many of the power brokers behind the Tories are strategic, but they only back winners.
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Fast forward 4 years, and despite the shameful manner in which the right-wing media have acted in recent times, I really believe they'll start backing Labour more and more. Look to 1997 when The S*n changed alliances to support New Labour.

It's telling that The Torygraph has been critical of this Government a lot recently, and even some of the articles in The Fail are starting to follow suit. Less than a year since the last election and a long 4 years until the next, but I think they know the writing is on the wall already for this cesspit of a Government.

I was, and remain, a huge fan of Jeremy Corbyn and really believe that had he somehow managed to come to power in 2017 or 2019 that the country would have been in a better place and on the path to a much fairer society. I still believe that despite his faults he is the most genuine and caring politician we have seen in this country for decades and while the Corbyn government sadly never materialised he still leaves a legacy, a one where the discussion has changed and where under Keir Starmer we hopefully have a real chance of eventually getting a Government that still has left-leanings; one that helps those who are in need rather than stampeding over them like a herd of wildebeest.

I consider myself to be quite strongly left-leaning but recognised that after Jeremy Corbyn, it was a case of accepting a more centrist Labour party in power than a left-leaning party in opposition. That is why I voted for Keir Starmer in the leadership election, despite my heart wanting Rebecca Long-Bailey.

So far, he has not shown I made the right decision along with the majority of the Labour Party.
 
Sheriff_John_Bunnell_ret said:
Well quite. We'll have to see if new bloke intends to ring any changes or if he just has nicer hair.
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This counts. It shouldn't, but it does. Especially for Conservative voters.

Democrats win more votes in Republican States when they look more 'Republican'. It's an interesting difference in mindsets between left and right. It's about looking like 'one of us' perhaps and it is certainly about appealing to traditional values.

Remember when Cameron chose to respond to Corbyn, not with an answer to the question posed, but to tell him to go out 'put on a proper suit and do your tie up, man'. It was instinctive from Cameron and it played extremely well with his MP's and Tory voters. Why? Because it matters to them. Starmer, like Blair, should and will use that I hope.
 
He is more wooden than Pinochio. He looks OK up against Johnson, who is a truly abysmal performer under questioning, but the tories will dump him well before the election. Neither are strong interviewees under pressure, although KS is less obviously a bullsh1tter. He helped lose the red wall seats by pushing the 'People's Vote'. He's certainly less loathsome than Johnson but I'd worry if the Tories replaced Johnson with someone who can give at least the appearance of competence.
 
JackG said:
He is more wooden than Pinochio. He looks OK up against Johnson, who is a truly abysmal performer under questioning, but the tories will dump him well before the election. Neither are strong interviewees under pressure, although KS is less obviously a bullsh1tter. He helped lose the red wall seats by pushing the 'People's Vote'. He's certainly less loathsome than Johnson but I'd worry if the Tories replaced Johnson with someone who can give at least the appearance of competence.
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Can you think of one decent tory out of this lot?

I can only think of someone like hunt who is away from the lime light at the moment
 
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