Just a thought about all these strikes

Fridgeman

Active member
Wouldn’t it be nice if instead of asking for pay rises they were instead insisting on reform of the tax system demanding lower taxes for all low earners ,proper change (real savings on tax)at the moment lower earners spend 70% of their income in tax in one form or another is there any wonder people are struggling and can you imagine the support the strikers would have from the lower paid public.

A couple of ideas
Raise the tax threshold to at 20k
Lower council tax ( based on earnings) raised for the higher earners accordingly
Reduce fuel duty and cancel the planned 23%rise coming in march
Cap house rents

People should be able to afford to live and save if they work instead of the system we currently have which is about to implode
 
Wouldn’t it be nice if instead of asking for pay rises they were instead insisting on reform of the tax system demanding lower taxes for all low earners ,proper change (real savings on tax)at the moment lower earners spend 70% of their income in tax in one form or another is there any wonder people are struggling and can you imagine the support the strikers would have from the lower paid public.

A couple of ideas
Raise the tax threshold to at 20k
Lower council tax ( based on earnings) raised for the higher earners accordingly
Reduce fuel duty and cancel the planned 23%rise coming in march
Cap house rents

People should be able to afford to live and save if they work instead of the system we currently have which is about to implode
Those ideas would decimate public sector funding, increase regional inequality and wouldn't help the lowest earners (apart from capping house rents).

I also don't see why people striking about their own conditions should be pushing for tax reform. It likely goes against their beliefs (especially public sector workers) and wouldn't do anything to resolve the problems most are facing. Especially teachers an NHS staff who are also suffering from a lack of funding, which reducing tax would make worse.

There isn't really a lack of support for striking workers either. Other than the rail workers, all polls show suppose over 50%. And the rail workers aren't too far off 50%. Which is pretty solid support, considering the inconvenience industrial action causes and the fact most of the media are vocal in their opposition to it.
 
Those ideas would decimate public sector funding, increase regional inequality and wouldn't help the lowest earners (apart from capping house rents).

I also don't see why people striking about their own conditions should be pushing for tax reform. It likely goes against their beliefs (especially public sector workers) and wouldn't do anything to resolve the problems most are facing. Especially teachers an NHS staff who are also suffering from a lack of funding, which reducing tax would make worse.

There isn't really a lack of support for striking workers either. Other than the rail workers, all polls show suppose over 50%. And the rail workers aren't too far off 50%. Which is pretty solid support, considering the inconvenience industrial action causes and the fact most of the media are vocal in their opposition to it.
Liz Truss might have joined FMTTM as part of her comeback tour.
 
Think of it more of changing the tax system (those who are really well of will pay more)rather than reducing tax, if the tax take is still the same then there would be no need to reduce services, it’s just an idea good or bad I can’t help feel that we need real change.

As a country we have had a monthly deficit for as long as I can remember which basically gets us to having the highest tax burden on individuals and the state ever and it will keep rising because we are so far away from balancing what comes in and what we spend, if inflation is over 10% but our lasted gdp figures show a modest 0.3% rise this means we are probably in real terms about minus 10% growth in the economy because like for like it should have increased with inflation just to stand still so to my thinking and sorry if I have this wrong but we would have to increase tax significantly to settle the pay disputes even for those who are going out on strike it’s a vicious circle and it’s going to make life a lot tougher for those who are low paid outside of the striking profession or for our younger generations

This feels like a change for the worst big companies making huge profits politicians not connected to reality food banks becoming a bigger part of society more people than ever taking their own lives if I offended anybody striking it wasn’t my intention I was just trying to get across that there are many people struggling now and regardless of how you have more disposable income (increase pay or paying less tax) it amounts to the same thing but by reducing tax for lower earners you would be helping the wider community. If I failed to get this across I apologise
 
Think of it more of changing the tax system (those who are really well of will pay more)rather than reducing tax, if the tax take is still the same then there would be no need to reduce services, it’s just an idea good or bad I can’t help feel that we need real change.

As a country we have had a monthly deficit for as long as I can remember which basically gets us to having the highest tax burden on individuals and the state ever and it will keep rising because we are so far away from balancing what comes in and what we spend, if inflation is over 10% but our lasted gdp figures show a modest 0.3% rise this means we are probably in real terms about minus 10% growth in the economy because like for like it should have increased with inflation just to stand still so to my thinking and sorry if I have this wrong but we would have to increase tax significantly to settle the pay disputes even for those who are going out on strike it’s a vicious circle and it’s going to make life a lot tougher for those who are low paid outside of the striking profession or for our younger generations

This feels like a change for the worst big companies making huge profits politicians not connected to reality food banks becoming a bigger part of society more people than ever taking their own lives if I offended anybody striking it wasn’t my intention I was just trying to get across that there are many people struggling now and regardless of how you have more disposable income (increase pay or paying less tax) it amounts to the same thing but by reducing tax for lower earners you would be helping the wider community. If I failed to get this across I apologise
The striking workers are part of a system. If the rest of the system is getting payrises each year then the strikers are getting relatively poorer every year. That is what they are complaining about. They aren't asking for payrises. They are just asking to stand still.

Some of the things you've mentioned could happen as well, not instead but it isn't in the remit of the workers to strike over something completely unrelated to their work.
 
The tax system does need reform

Saying to public sector workers…
Do you mind continuing to work under scandalous pressures whilst taking real term pay costs whilst this gets debated and probably kicked in the long grass…….
?
 
Just been talking to my wife while watching the Sunday news programmes. She's a civil servant in the DWP making complex assessments about Universal Credit claimants.

She's so poorly paid she could earn more stacking supermarket shelves. And that's no disrespect to those workers.
 
Here is the thing I am not knocking anyone striking I am just passing on my thoughts that the wider public is suffering too so change is surely needed the gap between have and have nots is rapidly increasing I am over 50 years old so I have seen a few things but the rate of decline in living standards for the majority of people is really shocking and it’s only going to get worse without real change
 
Here is the thing I am not knocking anyone striking I am just passing on my thoughts that the wider public is suffering too so change is surely needed the gap between have and have nots is rapidly increasing I am over 50 years old so I have seen a few things but the rate of decline in living standards for the majority of people is really shocking and it’s only going to get worse without real change
The wider public is suffering, noone disagrees with that. The disagreement is that 1) the strikes are about specific working conditions in specific sectors that have faced cuts for the last 12 years, even at times when everyone else was doing ok, and 2) your suggestions wouldn't help.

For example, if they tied council tax to earnings, affluent areas would have more money than their council could realistically spend. Whilst poorer areas would have to make even tougher decisions than they have to make now. If you tied them to average local earnings, then someone living in Middlesbrough would be worse off than someone on the same earnings living in Manchester. Then you've got the issue of considering how to handle fluctuating wages (commissions, agency workers, etc) and so many other factors. This would likely cost more to run and lead to worse outcomes for the areas that are suffering the most.

Economics is tough because every economic decision you make will have some kind of negative impact. There are no 100% positive decisions that you can make in macroeconomics The question is whether the positives outweigh the negatives. I'm not convinced that reducing taxes for anyone would help improve living standards by a significant amount. In my opinion biggest positive action the government could take to help lower earners is to subside public transport further, to divert funding to councils in more deprived areas, to place caps on the energy wholesalers and stop rent increases for the next 2 or 3 years. But all of these things have possible negative consequences and would require tax increases for some people.
 
Wouldn’t it be nice if instead of asking for pay rises they were instead insisting on reform of the tax system demanding lower taxes for all low earners ,proper change (real savings on tax)at the moment lower earners spend 70% of their income in tax in one form or another is there any wonder people are struggling and can you imagine the support the strikers would have from the lower paid public.

A couple of ideas
Raise the tax threshold to at 20k
Lower council tax ( based on earnings) raised for the higher earners accordingly
Reduce fuel duty and cancel the planned 23%rise coming in march
Cap house rents

People should be able to afford to live and save if they work instead of the system we currently have which is about to implode
Capping rent, how would that work exactly? London has massive rent rates in comparison to say teesside. £1500-£2000 for a cupboard as opposed to maybe £500-£600 for a 3 bed semi. What you basically wanting to do is drop house prices on the basis that people wouldn't own second homes or buy to lets reducing the demand on the housing market and drop prices. Good for new buyers but not exactly going to be popular with the majority of the uk seeing their house price drop and potentially end up in negative equity.

Council tax is a difficult one for me. I personally believe the fair way for it to work is to base it on household income rather than individual income. The higher rate tax payer is not exactly what you would class as well off. Yes they get a decent wage but 1 person say earning £100k would be worse off than a household with 2 earning £50k each. Same household income but totally different take home figures. £67k take home as opposed to £76k is significant to the tune of £750 per month after tax. The old poll tax system was probably more fair but wasn't popular as opposed to the if you have a bigger house worth more money you have to pay more to the council. Why exactly? if you have 2 people living in a nice big house and no kids why should they be penalised and have to pay more council tax for the things they don't use.

I don't envy any politician as its a thankless task that will only ever upset a portion of the public which every changes they make. Im not a fan of the whole system of having parties fighting each other and holding back ideas. Starmer stating he has his own ideas but not willing to suggest is basically due to him wanting self gain. The aim is to get the country back on its feet so why not work together but instead they fight each other.
 
I don’t have the answers for all the problems that we are facing but I will float this idea as a start regarding capping rents any new house purchase for the purpose of renting out could be capped very easily at a % of the value it was bought for so for example buy a house at 50k and cap the rent at a max of 10% per annum I know that near me there at homes selling for under 20k and then renting out for £600 per month now I think that is scandalous
 

Fridgeman, please read this article, its long, but i think it may answer your question.
There will be no relief whilst this goverment is in power, their agenda / policy is based on greed and elitism ok dress that up as driven by the market !
 
Just reading through the tones of the thread and it does feel like people have been offended or feel patronised but as I have said that was not my intention I feel like I can see the struggles people are having daily and to be honest it’s devastating and depressing at the same time but the scariest thing for me is that there are no signs of anything improving, I might have overlooked the complexity but my motivation was putting it out in the open that something is very wrong in our society
 
I don’t have the answers for all the problems that we are facing but I will float this idea as a start regarding capping rents any new house purchase for the purpose of renting out could be capped very easily at a % of the value it was bought for so for example buy a house at 50k and cap the rent at a max of 10% per annum I know that near me there at homes selling for under 20k and then renting out for £600 per month now I think that is scandalous
Where is that?
 
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