Genders

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“Identifying as” isn’t the same as what gender you were born.
I don't think you appreciate the current thinking although I respect your right to disagree with it if you do.

Biological sex is what you are born with, gender is how you identify.

Once a point in time they may have been synonymous but they are not used that way in discussion like this.
 
Question being asked here is about genders, not identification
OK, well if its purely about self-identity I suppose there is no limit and there doesn't need to be. I wouldn't care especially if someone thought they were a horse or the Pope and considered it to be their gender. I don't HAVE to agree with them. People on both sides of the debate need to accept that they can't control other people's thoughts, as long as they're not malicious that should be ok.

I know a bloke, absolute nutter, who identifies as Jesus. I've told him, he's no son of mine.
 
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You're not born a particular 'gender', you are born a particular 'biological sex'. Gender is a social construct so you can identify as whatever you please.
Whilst I have no dog in this fight that is *now* surely?

I seem to recall reading something about the gender definition and the definition of *woman* was changed by the OED after pressure from rights activists, or the winds of change of language use if you like?
 
Gender is a bit like politics

You have the right and the left, some are far right, some are far left.
Then you have the centre ground, which is a bit of a murky pool sometimes frequented by liberals and others.
Then you have others who want to abstain from voting.

Depending upon your circumstance you may move from one to another.
 
I am a father of a son who is trans. I am very proud of the mountains that he has climbed to be the guy that he is today. He has faced challenges that would stop many guys and in his early twenties is making a great life for himself. Before transitioning in his pre teens, he wash shy, withdrawn and miserable. Since transitioning he became much more confident and became a musician standing up in front of hundreds with his band.

There was a program on tele yesterday discussing gender. It was found that there were about 25% of the population who had male brains and 25% with female brains. Leaving 50% who were on the spectrum, using their brains and reasoning in different ways. When he was small my son played in very different ways to his sister even though they shared the same toys, so it wasnt a massive surprise ten years later when he told me that he thought he was a male, with the wrong body.

In most of the conversations that I see, it is always M to F transition that people discuss. There is also a number of F to M. I understand that my son will never be a sportsman, due to the drugs that he has taken, he is short and slight in stature so will not be a threat to anyone on the sports field. Good thing that he has taken a much greater interest in the creative world. The clamour for protecting female only spaces protected from men, is an interesting one. Should he use women toilets? I would love to see the reaction of most ladies to when this bearded looking male joins the queue, He looks more masculine than most men.

The issue most miss, is at what stage in transition do you change from M to F. The stages that I have witnessed;
1. Living life as a person of a different gender to that in which you were born.
2. Hormone blockers - to limit the gender related hormones
3. Hormones - to promote the new gender
4. Surgery - to reshape the body, i.e. breast reduction or to create new genitalia

Not every trans person feels the need to go through all of these procedures, but at which point do you legally change sex. I prefer to see it as a sliding scale, with a legal definition somewhere between 2-3 above.

Very good post. Much respect to you and your son for your journey and how you have handled it.
 
Yes that was my question 1 I haven’t been to France so wasn’t sure if that’s how it worked, cubicles is a non issue for a lot of people. I guess some females may not be happy about that set up.
The French are one of the most laid back people I have ever met when it comes to bodily functions. You will regularly see guys peeing on the side road and are not trying to hide themselves. You will be in supermarkets having a pee in a urinal and a woman will walk in and go to the cubicle. I have seen them queuing to go in while a man is standing having a pee - it always causes me stage fright. I have even gone the other way and gone into the women's toilets when the mens have been closed.

I once took a group of students (13& 14 year olds) to France camping and our site was on a sports ground. One of the girls come out of the toilets screaming because a man was stood in the corner having a pee in a urinal. She couldn't see anything, the man hadn't done anything, it was just not what we British do. Can you imagine the paperwork I had to complete and the report I had to submit on our return.
 
Two, anything else is just make believe.
So.. if someone is born with both male and female sexual organs.. what gender are they?
Are they make belief?

What about if your born with no genitals?
Is that not a gender?
 
So.. if someone is born with both male and female sexual organs.. what gender are they?
Are they make belief?

What about if your born with no genitals?
Is that not a gender?
Intersex, was called hermaphrodite.

Ambiguous genitalia with no genitals

Gender is different from biology
 
You're not born a particular 'gender', you are born a particular 'biological sex'. Gender is a social construct so you can identify as whatever you please.
Gender isn’t a social construct!! Show me a birth certificate with anything other than male/female beside the ‘gender’ column.

I cant continue with this it’s just silly!
 
Gender isn’t a social construct!! Show me a birth certificate with anything other than male/female beside the ‘gender’ column.

I cant continue with this it’s just silly!
You can change the gender on a birth certificate
 
So.. if someone is born with both male and female sexual organs.. what gender are they?
Are they make belief?

What about if your born with no genitals?
Is that not a gender?


If you are born with both male and female sexual organs you are either male or female, not both, or neither. Only one set of sexual organs ‘work’, there are no instances of both sets of sexual organs working.
 

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