Electric Car Advice
- Thread starter DanBoro4499
- Start date
Tryasize10
Well-known member
I'm currently at the point of looking to change my motor. I'm still struggling with the idea of going full E mainly as I don't have a drive and I reckon I only get to park directly outside my house 50% of the time, if that.
Andy_W
Well-known member
Should do, but if not the cabling is probably good enough to upgrade it easily. The main bit I suppose is having the cable ran to where the charger goes on it's own 32A breaker or better.
32A @ 230V = 7.4kW
A lot of cars now come with a 3 pin charger which also has a lead to change the 3 pin for a 32A commando plug, so if you have a commando socket you'll be good for up to 7kW, which is enough to charge any car fully overnight. This cuts out the need for the £500 wall box.
I've known a couple do it on the DIY, adding a commando socket onto the garage ring main on a 32A breaker, bit dodgy doing this mind, as having anything else plugged in on the same circuit would blow the breaker, and this almost certainly not meet regs.
Andy_W
Well-known member
If you plugged in for 12 hours, once a week, and had a commando socket or wall box this would be 14 x 7kW = 84kW = 250 miles (assuming the car has 250 mile range). It's doable, if you have consistent journeys, but not ideal. The problem would be if you didn't top up after a few journeys, and then couldn't get a space outside the house. You might get caught out once a month or so, and then have to go and plug in somewhere local whilst you went shopping or whatever.
SmallTown
Well-known member
Yeah, apart from round near em there is a big infrastructure gap here. We have charger plugs in the street lamps which helps as practically no one has a driveway around here. This needs rolling out throughout the country. Have you looked on https://www.zap-map.com ? To see if there is a charger near your house or work? I have constant problems with the charger in my apartments. Luckily my old office was near a public charger and my new office has a charger. So I just charged up at work. and, of course, if you have a 300 mile range then you don't need to charge every day. Just once in a while.
Andy_W
Well-known member
This does need sorting all over, but is gonna be one hell of a work in progress. I suppose it's a case by case basis if people can get away without home charging, will depend a lot on range, trips, work etc, where as those with a drive should be fine in 99% of instances.
How do you pay for the street light charging? What rate is that at?
SmallTown
Well-known member
It depends on the provider I think. The ones near us are shell (ubitricity) and have just gone up to 34p per kW. Charging speeds are around 5kwh.
I don't use them personally but only because I have a source london membership so tend to use their 7KW chargers when my BP Pulse apartment charger is broken, which is more often than not
Tryasize10
Well-known member
What would be the advice re running a cable to the car across a footpath, as that is what id have to do. Is it legal or am I going to end up in bother for tripping up some old dear?
SmallTown
Well-known member
I see plenty of people do this. Get something to cover up the cable and put a sign up. You should be grand
On the amount of DC charging: is there not some way of getting the charging history? My car is pretty smart and seems to pull all of the stats back in my app but never thought to look for ratio of DC/AC charging. I wouldn't be surprised if the info is stored in there though. That could provide some info for potential buyers if so.
High mileage isn't necessarily an indication of wear. Someone doing 100m a day on the motorway is less damaging to an ICE car than doing 50 miles of stop/start traffic like a taxi might do. Not sure if it is the same for EVs as they are mechanically simpler.
Have a look on your council website because some councils will fit an EV charger outside your house on request but not every council does it (most don't yet).
High mileage isn't necessarily an indication of wear. Someone doing 100m a day on the motorway is less damaging to an ICE car than doing 50 miles of stop/start traffic like a taxi might do. Not sure if it is the same for EVs as they are mechanically simpler.
Have a look on your council website because some councils will fit an EV charger outside your house on request but not every council does it (most don't yet).
Robborevolution
Member
@Andy_W you have obviously done a lot of research in to this. I have never leased but my concern with buying electric at the moment is the pace of technology. In the next 2-3 years are we likely to get cars with 500-600 mile range and what will that do to the value of current EVs? Looking to change car in next 12 months but really unsure which way to go as don’t want to suffer a massive loss in depreciation. Leasing would remove some of that although costs are extortionate at the moment
SmallTown
Well-known member
That's a good point. Not sure if you can. With a Tesla there is an app called scan my tesla. Which will tell you battery deg. You needs an ODBC2 connecter though to integrate the cars computer. I use it a lot and it's brilliant I think some other car have similar apps useful bevasue it tells you deg, usable battery capacity and even the amount of KW that have gone through DC and AC
Andy_W
Well-known member
Haha, I research everything I've got an interest in
500-600 mile range isn't the answer for 99% of people, extra long range cars are just there to appease the mind of those who think they need that, in reality next to nobody does, and once we get the charging infrastructure fully sorted, nobody does.
The future is an a actual 200 mile motorway range car (or 250 mile quoted/ WLTP range), which can do that from a 30-50kWh battery, and which can charge at over 300kWh, so in very basic terms you drive 200 miles and then charge up in 5-10 minutes. Carrying around a bigger battery/ unnecessary range is a waste of energy, especially as the batteries carry so much weight, and it also makes the handling worse. I can't see how they're going to make
My car has 250 mile range from a 90kW battery, but charges at 270kW, so in theory that's 250 miles range in 20 minutes, but more often than not would mean a top up of 200 miles in 15 minutes (if the charger could put out that, I aim for ones which can, or at least 150kW). Mines a high performance sports car though, and these will always be less efficient, so a bit of a different comparison.
All motorway services will have loads of 150kW chargers soon enough, and eventually 350kW. The 350kW rollout has already started (Wetherby now has 12 of them).
The most important things for future cars is charging speed and car efficiency. 2 miles per kW was standard, now it's more like 3-4 miles per kW for a mid-large sized car and some smaller cars can do 7.
A lot of 2-3 year old ev's can charge at 100kW, with a 70-80kW battery, and 3 miles per kW efficiency (or smaller battery/ but more efficient). They're pretty much going to be stopping every 200 miles for half an hour or so, and I think on long trips people stop for 30-45 mins every 200 miles anyway. I think they current cars have it cracked to match petrol/ life anyway, just need more of those faster chargers to get the faster charging cars out of the way and charge the slower ones at full pelt.
For most people, charging speed should be more important on a used EV, than range, providing the range was over 200 miles. Anything over 100 kWh speed is good, over 150 great, 200 even better.
Last edited:
SmallTown
Well-known member
Absolutely this! I've tried to explain the range conundrum on here but people are refusing to believe it. I guess because the makers of ICE want you to think it's an issue. There's some serious brainwashing going on.Haha, I research everything I've got an interest in
500-600 mile range isn't the answer for 99% of people, extra long range cars are just there to appease the mind of those who think they need that, in reality next to nobody does, and once we get the charging infrastructure fully sorted, nobody does.
For most people, charging speed should be more important on a used EV, than range, providing the range was over 200 miles. Anything over 100 kWh speed is good, over 150 great, 200 even better.
For long journeys of more than a single charge: Charging speed is far far more important than range. Especially when people get used to using their EV properly and maximising their charging (rough guide: you want to get to a DC charger below 10% and charge to about 60-80% for the most efficient way of charging) depends on the car of course but this will serve you well. One of the cars I looked at to replace my Tesla was a Polestar 2. It's better built to an almost ludicrous extent. Is a lot more comfortable to drive, has a nicer cabin and a similar range. I turned it down though because the charge curve is significantly worse than the Tesla. Tesla can take higher speeds and charge at highs speeds for longer.
Billy69_uk
Well-known member
I came soooo close to ordering a new EV company car, but bottled out at the last minute and have opted out of the co car scheme and placed an order for a new Golf GTi.
I am not sure why I didnt get one, I work in the industry and see daily the advances in batteries, fuel cells and hydrogen etc and the tech is really going places.
I guess at this moment in time, I just dont want one badly enough. Now, if the Porsche Taycan came onto the co car list in a year's time, then my wife will be very pleased to get a slightly used Golf GTi.
I am not sure why I didnt get one, I work in the industry and see daily the advances in batteries, fuel cells and hydrogen etc and the tech is really going places.
I guess at this moment in time, I just dont want one badly enough. Now, if the Porsche Taycan came onto the co car list in a year's time, then my wife will be very pleased to get a slightly used Golf GTi.
Re leasing - can anyone recommend a good company to use for this?
Not bought a car in years but need to update my car now - new/used not fussed either way but not sure where to start with lease deals (or even PCP). Hear lots of stories about people getting good deals but when I've looked at pretty bog standard cars (fords, Hyundai, kia) etc through the main websites then monthly prices seem extortionate. Was looking at lease deal for a focus and it was £350 a month allowing for 10000 miles a year. Thought you'd be able to get Audi a4/bmw 3 series for that sort of price but maybe I'm just out of the loop.
Would definitely be open to idea of an electric car in the above price bracket - if anyone knows of anything going like that.
Not bought a car in years but need to update my car now - new/used not fussed either way but not sure where to start with lease deals (or even PCP). Hear lots of stories about people getting good deals but when I've looked at pretty bog standard cars (fords, Hyundai, kia) etc through the main websites then monthly prices seem extortionate. Was looking at lease deal for a focus and it was £350 a month allowing for 10000 miles a year. Thought you'd be able to get Audi a4/bmw 3 series for that sort of price but maybe I'm just out of the loop.
Would definitely be open to idea of an electric car in the above price bracket - if anyone knows of anything going like that.
Last edited:
Andy_W
Well-known member
If you can afford the PCP payments and get a fairly good APR or maybe even 0% then maybe do that, otherwise you're going to flush a boat load of equity down the drain. Saving £50 on a lease per month makes little sense if you're giving away £150 a month equity.
The problem you might have is that a lot of the big premium manufacturers you mention, like Audi and BMW have largely only really concentrated on the higher spec versions of saloons/ larger/ faster cars etc. The BMW i4 for example is 54k (340hp 5.7secs 0-60), and the petrol equivalent of that is a 430i grand coupe Auto, which is 51k. So both of those would be about £650 a month, which is a lot, either way. The Hyundai Iqonic 5 is around 40k, so around £500 a month, a Pugeot e-208 or VW ID3 about 30k, so £400 a month. A petrol focus is going to be 25k+ for similar spec, and like you say £350 a month.
Something like an electric 3 series is not due until like 2025, probably as they need to hit a lower price bracket and expect it to sell loads, so wanted time to get all the tech right. It's going to be north of 40k though, but even the cheapest petrol 3 series is 38k, a 1 series is 27k now! There may be a few 1 series electric in 2023, but they will be the higher spec ones first.
You'll save £100 a month at least with electric, if you're currently spending £200 on petrol or whatever, and you won't have any car tax/ VED to pay.
£400 + £100 is less than £350 + £200 etc, and with the former you're likely to build up more equity, so it will be cheaper total per month, and less down the drain so to speak.
Like everything, cars are just expensive now, whether that's second hand or new, EV or ICE.
Carwow is quite good for finding deals, but there aren't many now as cars are in massive demand, and the finance rates are crap as the economy is down the pan.
JustTheGent
Well-known member
Proof is in the pudding.
truck
Well-known member
I recently had to stick £100 in and that hit home, plus £75 into a corsa. Some interesting data re costs posted on here but a lot of the EV with decent ranges seem to be £35K plus thats a hefty tag, so it looks as though swings and roundabouts re where the costs can be.
Vast majority of drivers their average journey is around 8 miles, most could happily work with a car with a genuine 150 mile range. Need prices to soften but I have this niggling feeling that as the government is push drivers into EV's the tax advantages will be removed once they have their nice captive market
Johnnyweetabix
Well-known member
I’ve got the polestar 2 and had it since October . Only needed to use it at a public charger once and used a Tesla supercharger . Took about 40 mins to give a 60% boost .
Great car though