Astra Zeneca vaccine withdrawn

I wouldn’t really describe Gates as a leader, he’s more of a businessman I’d say - does he benefit from the sale of vaccines ? I don’t know the answer to that question for sure, but I’m guessing he probably hasn’t invested large sums of money in various drug companies without expecting some kind of return on his investment
He's one of the most powerful men in the world, he's a leader. If he isn't, who is? The GDP of his companies is more than that of most countries.

Also the leader of the second largest charitable foundation in the world, which he's donated over $40bn to. To expect him to want a "return" on everything, seems a bit odd, when he's given more money away than any person on the planet, who has ever lived.

I'd call him a very clever guy, who has spent more money on charity, health, education and poverty prevention than probably any individual in the world ever, he's done more good than every anti-vaxer put together.

He's probably the most odd choice that any of the conspiracy/ anti-vax lot could have chosen to go after, it says a lot more about those going after him, than it does Gates.
 
He's one of the most powerful men in the world, he's a leader. If he isn't, who is? The GDP of his companies is more than that of most countries.

Also the leader of the second largest charitable foundation in the world, which he's donated over $40bn to. To expect him to want a "return" on everything, seems a bit odd, when he's given more money away than any person on the planet, who has ever lived.

I'd call him a very clever guy, who has spent more money on charity, health, education and poverty prevention than probably any individual in the world ever, he's done more good than every anti-vaxer put together.

He's probably the most odd choice that any of the conspiracy/ anti-vax lot could have chosen to go after, it says a lot more about those going after him, than it does Gates.
Do you think he’d make a good President of the USA - maybe he should run for that
 
Do you think he’d make a good President of the USA - maybe he should run for that
You seem to have tried to shift the line of the conversation, why is that?

But in answer to your question, I've no idea, the last non politician was a disaster though, but he only did it to nurse his fragile ego, Gates doesn't seem to be like that.

I expect he's already quite a busy man doing what he's doing, and wouldn't want to detract from that good work.

They should be able to find someone half decent for the job, but seemed to have struggled since Obama.
 
He's one of the most powerful men in the world, he's a leader. If he isn't, who is? The GDP of his companies is more than that of most countries.

Also the leader of the second largest charitable foundation in the world, which he's donated over $40bn to. To expect him to want a "return" on everything, seems a bit odd, when he's given more money away than any person on the planet, who has ever lived.

I'd call him a very clever guy, who has spent more money on charity, health, education and poverty prevention than probably any individual in the world ever, he's done more good than every anti-vaxer put together.

He's probably the most odd choice that any of the conspiracy/ anti-vax lot could have chosen to go after, it says a lot more about those going after him, than it does Gates.

That's all very good but it doesn't excuse putting chips in our bodies to monitor and control us.
 
All I know is, after my covid shot, my 5G reception was soooo much better ;) 🤣
that’s another one they believed, along with the heavy metals that form razor blades and cut tour insides to pieces. Full of Graphene Oxide those jabs that are designed to depopulate (as the population grows everywhere). File alongside ‘every vaccinated person will be dead in 6/12/24/36/48/60/600/1200* months

* delete as applicable
 
The definition of something being "unsafe" is laughable, when it actually reduces risk for the general population.
The trouble is, that’s the honest way to present the data. It’s how they presented it in the first couple of months. Risk versus benefit. Death by Vallance’s graphs and spreadsheets. I think it was unfortunate that they stopped doing this and reduced it to a three word soundbite. We are naturally suspicious of those.

The net benefit on average is absolutely massive, although it does differ with age. There is no age group where the risk is higher for taking the AZ vaccine, than the risk that comes with covid though.
That’s not quite the whole stat. You need to factor in the likelihood of infection as well. If you have the vaccine your likelihood of having had the vaccine is 100%. Your likelihood of getting Covid isn’t. Where a disease is as widespread as Covid was that isn’t very material though.

Even if he's 40-49 the risk of death if you catch covid is near 1 in 3,000, the risk of death from the AZ vaccine is ~1 in a million, about the same chance of dying by lightening strike. Anyone has got more chance of being murdered in any month, than being killed by a vaccine.
But with this example you make the same error and it is material. The chance of dying from a lightning strike is massively higher than 1 in a million. It’s the likelihood of being struck in the first place that is remote.

Ask him if he would be willing to do do some things which would actually be risk averse, like getting in shape, not eating junk or drinking booze etc? Every 250 miles in a car is more risk than any vaccine.
Indeed.
 
The trouble is, that’s the honest way to present the data. It’s how they presented it in the first couple of months. Risk versus benefit. Death by Vallance’s graphs and spreadsheets. I think it was unfortunate that they stopped doing this and reduced it to a three word soundbite. We are naturally suspicious of those.


That’s not quite the whole stat. You need to factor in the likelihood of infection as well. If you have the vaccine your likelihood of having had the vaccine is 100%. Your likelihood of getting Covid isn’t. Where a disease is as widespread as Covid was that isn’t very material though.


But with this example you make the same error and it is material. The chance of dying from a lightning strike is massively higher than 1 in a million. It’s the likelihood of being struck in the first place that is remote.


Indeed.
I get what you're saying, but it would have had an additional layer of detail that some would have been incapable of understanding, or it would have been another layer to try and argue against. When they can't understand the basics of it, making it more complicated is often not the way. All that adding detail would do is strengthen the scientists/ my arguments, but that doesn't need strengthening, as it was already known as the right choice. You could go even further and say read the scientific papers, this would add more certainty, but there's zero chance of an anti vaxer reading it, understanding it and putting together an argument against it.

The likelihood of exposure was probably close to 1 for anyone in the developed world, so the chance of infection was extremely high, even more so if we "let it rip" with no lockdowns and had nobody taking vaccines etc. It's like how I used to say you can fight covid with antibody protection from vaccines, or from having covid, but the scenario of not getting covid with no antibodies was remote, so remote that it didn't even need to be in the conversation. Loads of the anti vax lot, were the same people who said covid didn't even exist, or "was a cold" etc, they're not rational enough to understand, or don't want to understand, or actively promote misunderstanding to line their own pockets.

If I remember correctly ~70% had caught covid by the end of 2021, which was before the Omicron wave. So if you add Omicron, and took away vaccines, then surely it's fair to assume at least 95% are going to catch it.

Even if you said the risk of infection was 50%, it just means the benefit might be 5:1, rather than 10:1 etc, 5:1 is still a massive winner.

The lightening strike example includes being struck, i.e it's the odds of being struck and dying, you don't die without being struck. Well, actually you can die without being directly struck, it's happened a few times, but think people would still class that as death by lightening strike.
 
Sorry my inner pedant is screaming at me.

Lightening - reducing weight or perhaps adding white pigment to a colour

Lightning - 1,000,000 volts of white death from above, divine judgement, etc.

After reading some of the opinions in this thread, I expect that after my 7th Jab, all of the above would apply to me in such a way that I could be a villain in a Marvel film.
 
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