America - prodding the bees nest

ForssAwakens

Well-known member
The seemed to be the ones telling everyone about Russia publicly, ramping it up

Now they are doing the same with Taiwan. Are The American got an agenda for war
 
American governments love a proxy war. Its cheaper than a real one and they get to stand back and acclaim themselves as the righteous ones.
 
The seemed to be the ones telling everyone about Russia publicly, ramping it up

Now they are doing the same with Taiwan. Are The American got an agenda for war
I think this is more about business links with Taiwan, they don't want China to get their tech industry because that will hurt US industry.
 
Are The American got an agenda for war
China last year says this…


"The historical task of the complete reunification of the motherland must be fulfilled, and will definitely be fulfilled”


And yet you blame the US ?

There’s a reason China is so quiet and passive on Russia war in Ukraine.

Btw the Biden White House did not sanction the pelosi trip.
 
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Same as when they banned Huawei products. The US didn't like a tech company making better and cheaper products than Apple so they pretended that Huawei hardware is spying on everyone.
Did they need to pretend? The Wikipedia page details numerous incidents of backsoors being discovered over the years on networks they've been involved in
 
Did they need to pretend? The Wikipedia page details numerous incidents of backsoors being discovered over the years on networks they've been involved in
Maybe/maybe not. I still think it's a bit of a ruse. They can't be any worse than all of the other tech companies that harvest data.
 
There's an episode of The West Wing called Hartsfield Landing.

I think the US will be playing a similar game here, if not for the same reason.
There is indeed.

But unlike in the west China don’t grand stand ( Xi isn’t saying this to garner support from his base) they don’t need to when China speaks they act on it.

So that makes his words all the more chilling.

"The historical task of the complete reunification of the motherland must be fulfilled, and will definitely be fulfilled”
President Xi - 2021

Not much ambiguity in that.
 
There is indeed.

But unlike in the west China don’t grand stand ( Xi isn’t saying this to garner support from his base) they don’t need to when China speaks they act on it.

So that makes his words all the more chilling.

"The historical task of the complete reunification of the motherland must be fulfilled, and will definitely be fulfilled”
President Xi - 2021

Not much ambiguity in that.

Indeed. It is definitely what Xi wants to do. The only thing that will give him pause is if it looks like China could end up with a disaster like Ukraine is proving for Russia. An amphibious assault is far more challenging than the land invasion of a neighbour, unless it is unopposed and there is overwhelming firepower.

America is letting them him know they are not distracted nor uninterested.
 
Indeed. It is definitely what Xi wants to do. The only thing that will give him pause is if it looks like China could end up with a disaster like Ukraine is proving for Russia. An amphibious assault is far more challenging than the land invasion of a neighbour, unless it is unopposed and there is overwhelming firepower.
I don't see China being able to do this without both significant loss to chinese troops, destruction of Taiwan, so what's the point in owning land that has been utterly levelled, and of course facing off with the US and the inevitable trade restrictions hitting their economy. I just don't see this happening any time soon.
 
"The historical task of the complete reunification of the motherland must be fulfilled, and will definitely be fulfilled”
President Xi - 2021

Not much ambiguity in that.
Similar to many other territorial claims around the world, no leader of a country is going to abandon a territorial claim but will re assert it. If they wanted to retake Taiwan militarily it would be touch and go if it was achievable at all and it would definitely be incredibly costly in terms of casualties and in damage to Taiwanese infrastructure, to their own economy and possibly to the acquiescence of their people to Communist rule. Argentina maintains their claim to Las Malvinas without any realistic hope of making it happen. I suspect that they had rather hoped the "test case" in Ukraine had gone slightly better?
 
I don't see China being able to do this without both significant loss to chinese troops, destruction of Taiwan, so what's the point in owning land that has been utterly levelled, and of course facing off with the US and the inevitable trade restrictions hitting their economy. I just don't see this happening any time soon.

Many of the analysts who predicted Russia wouldn't invade Ukraine did so because they looked at it rationally like that. The were right in that Russia shouldn't invade, but Putin did.

Partly that was because Putin's intelligence services were not looking at accurate information. That's what happens when you create a culture where speaking truth to power is dissuaded. The info that gets passed up the chain is slanted towards what people want to hear and not what they don't want to hear. So some western analysts were more informed than the top brass in the Kremlin.

Partly it was Putin looking at the West's response to his Crimea invasion, which was weak, to Afghanistan, which was weak and his assessment that the West, with it's economic self interest and divisions (exacerbated by Russian money), would not respond strongly like they did.

Partly it was Russia overestimating the Russian military capabilities and underestimating the Ukrainians military resistance capabilities and determination, combined with Western military assistance.

The biggest factor though, was simply Putin's own deep seated desire to restore Russia to it's former size and status as it had when it was the Soviet Union. He really wanted to do this, all the other factors just nudged him into thinking he could manage it.

There are parallels to be drawn with China and Taiwan. Xi definitely strongly desires Taiwan so that is the biggest factor to take into account. The question is whether he can do this. Like Putin, he had seen very little from the West re Hong Kong, Tibet and the Uighurs. There was also Crimea, Afghanistan, Syria -until Ukraine it seemed like America was withdrawing from the world militarily and economically. The West does rely on China economically to a huge degree and China has massive influence. The so called Belt and Road initiative gives them huge economic and therefore political influence all over the world.

I think America, while not officially endorsing Pelosi's trip at the White House, are putting Xi on notice that, like Ukraine, they are not uninterested in Taiwan, which does hold strategic economic importance to the USA. It puts doubts in his mind that this far more difficult military operation, which would require massive overwhelming superiority of not just numbers, but firepower, as well as being a logistical nightmare, could be a big gamble. China's military has not really been tested, their performance is an unknown. America's is not.

There would be big economic repercussions for the West, but also for China too. Ukraine has shown the West is prepared to put up with them at least for now and to a degree.

Ukraine has also shown that, perhaps, the West might have been napping recently, but it's been roused and when it is, it can still get very serious. An eastern power expanded it's influence in the 1930's, as China remembers only too well, but when it went too far in 1941 the world saw just how serious America and it's allies could get. They will be wary of making that mistake.

I think Xi played Putin. He may have wanted just one more test of the West to see what would happen. China didn't support the Russian invasion, but nor did Xi dissuade Putin.

This Pelosi move is smart, they know she is a big player in the Democratic Party and though not officially in the Biden administration her influence on delivering and directing policy is huge. She is a very savvy political operator and this has given the Chinese a lot to think about and a lot of analysing to do.
 
Similar to many other territorial claims around the world, no leader of a country is going to abandon a territorial claim but will re assert it. If they wanted to retake Taiwan militarily it would be touch and go if it was achievable at all and it would definitely be incredibly costly in terms of casualties and in damage to Taiwanese infrastructure, to their own economy and possibly to the acquiescence of their people to Communist rule. Argentina maintains their claim to Las Malvinas without any realistic hope of making it happen. I suspect that they had rather hoped the "test case" in Ukraine had gone slightly better?
All true but XI did say that
 
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