Air India Flight to Gatwick crash - unconfirmed 242 on board

Nero80 said:
Yea i was on the understanding if the plane isnt correctly configured for take off or landing then an audible alarm sounds
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Aye, and sometimes a visual aid too but it's probably not all that obvious, not with what else is going on.

Like with almost any warning though, if pilots have a lot on they can cancel the audio warning, and the idea is they remember that and deal with it later, some times they don't remember. Sometimes the warning might repeat after a certain amount of time.
 
ForssAwakens said:
Wasn’t it recorded at 600ft when it lost signal therefore could have continued and likely to have continued climbing for a short period
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The data put out is only intermittent, especially what ends up in flight radar, be lucky to get an update a minute I bet. Data probably sent out high frequency too, so not that great low level, esp if line of sight is poor.
 
Lefty said:
https://twitter.com/x/status/1933169063456325790
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That looks like it's blown from the floor, doesn't look like it's from the engines or doesn't look like engines in trouble anyway.

Normally you don't get dust blown up off the deck, as basically all the previous planes have blown it all away when taking off from the same spot (about 1/2 to 2/3rds down the runway, and runways are kept exceptionally clean.

You can get that though if a plane takes off from the very end of the runway, as it's blowing stuff which isn't normally subject to efflux at that angle/ proximity.

If it was a power problem, they might have gone passed the V1 point (decision speed, whether to abort or not) and had a problem which they never had time to back out off, so basically had to take off, then didn't quite make it up V2 safety speed for takeoff, but it's what they had to go with. As soon as it got up (caused by the angle of attack change) then it came straight back down.

Or they just didn't have the lift setup (or something interfered with it), so even rotating with the wrong lift setup will take the jet off, due to the momentum v angle of attack, but momentum doesn't beat gravity for long at that AOA without lift assistance.

Lift and/ or power look most likely to me at least.
 
Seems that the survivor's brother has died in the crash, imagine walking away from all of that alive knowing that your brother has perished. What an awful tragedy for everyone involved!
 
The really stupid thing in this is that crash was survivable.. put a field or a body of water in the path instead of a built up area and they should be all walking away

Massive advert for not building around airports… they need room for these exact situation
 
Coming from an aviation background and working with a global airline currently, the first thing that strikes me is the flaps aren't set. At V1, around 160kts (weight dependent) the aircraft should rotate as normal and lift. Though it does, it looks heavy. It also doesn't have the flaps/slats in the correct position for lift . They never reach V2 for a positive climb. On another video on the BBC, just before the aircraft drops more quickly it looks like full power is applied as the nose briefly lifts up but it continues to fall. One of two things caused this in my opinion. Either pilot error (too heavy, wrong take off speed and flaps not set meaning no lift) or its potentially a double engine failure, though the likelihood of that seems very unlikely as it got off the ground and climbed initially. Also you'd expect the gear to be retracted but with everything going on, the mayday call and so on, they probably missed this. Sad times either way.
 
Acklam_Lad said:
The really stupid thing in this is that crash was survivable.. put a field or a body of water in the path instead of a built up area and they should be all walking away

Massive advert for not building around airports… they need room for these exact situation
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Not many aircraft that size survive landing in a field/ on water, full of fuel, that soon after take off as the pilots don't get time to figure out what is going on or how to fix it, not with the panic. You would need water/ fields both sides too as they take off in different directions due to the wind.

Problem is people don't want airports in the middle of nowhere, people even whinge about how long it takes to get to Heathrow from the centre of London. Then like with a lot of airports which were built out of town slightly, the buildings came to them.

People are subconsciously taking the 1 in 1,000,000 chance of a crash or 1 in 10,000,000 of dying, than have the extra hour travel time etc.

You could have longer runways though, if this was twice as long they could have landed and stopped, but then it comes down to cost of course, people don't want to pay for it.

If the runways were a bit longer the pilots would have more time after v1/v2 to bail though, as most feel like they don't want to risk overshooting the runway. Like in this case, it might pan out that these could have bailed after v1/v2, not took off or come back down, overshot the runway and someone gets a bill of a few million for a repair/ the disruption and most survive, but always easy saying that in hindsight.

There's a lot of pressure for take off slots, landing slots, go arounds from air traffic, plus there's also the internal pressures and wanting to be on schedule to the customers (big wigs). These pressures have a high impact on a lot of problems, the pilots sometimes feel like they can't say no. It's not meant to be like this, the pilots shouldn't be penalised for being safe, but it still happens.
 
RIP to all onboard and condolences to their loved ones.
I’m also an aviation engineer and agree with comments about flaps etc.
possibly add into the mix FOD ingestion on takeoff??
I read the only surviving passenger was in seat 11a .
I’m flying next week and have been randomly allocated seat 11a.
 
Sammysmiths said:
RIP to all onboard and condolences to their loved ones.
I’m also an aviation engineer and agree with comments about flaps etc.
possibly add into the mix FOD ingestion on takeoff??
I read the only surviving passenger was in seat 11a .
I’m flying next week and have been randomly allocated seat 11a.
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FOD in both engines seems unlikely, enough to lose that much power too, would probably have needed that ingestion to happen in a busy bit of the runway, to cause a problem which leads to the aircraft using all the runway. Might also have been visible out the back end earlier on take off and they probably would have got vibration warnings at least and backed out. Not impossible though.

Being given 11a is an odd one for you!
 
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