Dorman Long Tower - Listed Building Status

BoroMart said:
like I said removing listed status has to be far far more onerous than gaining it, otherwise the status is pointless. Took months or years of work to gain that status They got rid of the status via one phone call. Minutes. No listed building is now safe.
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It didn't take months or years.
The application was very recent.

"We recently received an urgent application to list Dorman Long Coal Bunker. After careful consideration we advised that it should be listed at Grade II."

Now that's obviously because a big part of the mechanism for listed status is the imminent threat of destruction/demolition, but it was still a sudden change in status.
 
BoroMart said:
It didn't take minutes did it
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You don't know that the delisting did either, that's an assumption.

Though I suspect that it wasn't really high on her priority list in a new job, so I'd concede that it was probably done quickly.
 
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This is an assumption on my part, given the link itself is now a dead end, but that seems to indicate that the application was received on the 10th of September and confirmed on the 13th.
 
It's already been status that it was delisted by a call from the Mayor to the new secretary who had been in post just 4 hours.
 
LaPennaBianca said:
The renovation of Elizabeth Tower, housing Big Ben has cost almost £80m. That's a lot of money for something that's not fit for purpose. Why should we pay all that money to tell Londoners, who all have phones and watches, the time?
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Ridiculous comparison, if you read the gazette replies a lot of people who live on Teesside wanted it gone,and the furnace.but your granddad worked in the steel industry so we should spend tens of millions to keep derilict disused buildings of no use.
 
BoroMart said:
It's already been status that it was delisted by a call from the Mayor to the new secretary who had been in post just 4 hours.
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Historic England were already re-reviewing the evidence around providing listed status on the 14th after a request on the 13th.

Nadine Dorries was appointed on the 15th.

Historic England's report was integral in the decision to rescind the status, it's not just a underhand plot.
You could question their motives with it, but then that also delegitimizes their right to grant the status in the first place.
 
TeaCider said:
Historic England were already re-reviewing the evidence around providing listed status on the 14th after a request on the 13th.

Nadine Dorries was appointed on the 15th.

Historic England's report was integral in the decision to rescind the status, it's not just a underhand plot.
You could question their motives with it, but then that also delegitimizes their right to grant the status in the first place.
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Wow, it's actually frightening that you think due process to something like this takes a single day.

Well, you don't, you're just trying to defend the corrupt tories for some reason. That's equally as frightening .
 
Ex pfc wintergreen said:
Ridiculous comparison, if you read the gazette replies a lot of people who live on Teesside wanted it gone,and the furnace.but your granddad worked in the steel industry so we should spend tens of millions to keep derilict disused buildings of no use.
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Yes, the replies on the Gazette website - a perfectly representative cross section of society😂

I'm saying it has social and cultural importance - you don't agree, obviously. But that doesn't make your interpretation of what should and shouldn't be preserved for posterity correct.

Newy has pointed out why the building is architecturally important - many on here have pointed to how they believe it represents their heritage. Your arguments about things being 'useless' have been countered.

This all just smacks of you thinking that your opinion is more important than everyone else's and that your narrow idea of what represents 'heritage' is the only one.
 
LaPennaBianca said:
Yes, the replies on the Gazette website - a perfectly representative cross section of society😂

I'm saying it has social and cultural importance - you don't agree, obviously. But that doesn't make your interpretation of what should and shouldn't be preserved for posterity correct.

Newy has pointed out why the building is architecturally important - many on here have pointed to how they believe it represents their heritage. Your arguments about things being 'useless' have been countered.

This all just smacks of you thinking that your opinion is more important than everyone else's and that your narrow idea of what represents 'heritage' is the only one.
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My opinion is no more important than anyone else's,so let's clear that one.
I mentioned the gazette because local people commented on there and many said get rid of the tower ( as many on here have said).
Architecturally important means something only to architects,
The building wanted too much money spending on it and had a LTD life span,so yes it was useless.
It had no social or cultural importance, it was used for twenty years and left for forty five,they built and closed a whole steel complex in that time.it was a landmark nothing more.
As I've stated on here many times,it's the people who never worked in the steel works who romanticise and revere it. To those who did it was a job.
It seems the people clinging to a heritage of iron and steel making are the ones who are narrow minded.. It's gone and will have little relevance to the millennials now and their future offspring.
Consett,Corby,Ravenscraig are three steel works that were shut and demolished in the eighties and nineties, Others have been downscaled, stop looking back to a time you never knew.
 
Ex pfc wintergreen said:
My opinion is no more important than anyone else's,so let's clear that one.
I mentioned the gazette because local people commented on there and many said get rid of the tower ( as many on here have said).
Architecturally important means something only to architects,
The building wanted too much money spending on it and had a LTD life span,so yes it was useless.
It had no social or cultural importance, it was used for twenty years and left for forty five,they built and closed a whole steel complex in that time.it was a landmark nothing more.
As I've stated on here many times,it's the people who never worked in the steel works who romanticise and revere it. To those who did it was a job.
It seems the people clinging to a heritage of iron and steel making are the ones who are narrow minded.. It's gone and will have little relevance to the millennials now and their future offspring.
Consett,Corby,Ravenscraig are three steel works that were shut and demolished in the eighties and nineties, Others have been downscaled, stop looking back to a time you never knew.
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Amazing that in telling me that you don't think your opinion is more important than anyone else's you tell me exactly what I think and why I think it.

I'll deal with the last one - looking back on times we never knew is exactly what groups of people do - it's what ties them together. Whether they're football teams, countries or communities. Wanting to get rid of that, or policing what 'that' should be, is exactly what's atomising our society.
 
TeaCider said:
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This is an assumption on my part, given the link itself is now a dead end, but that seems to indicate that the application was received on the 10th of September and confirmed on the 13th.
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I think listed status was granted in response to Newy's application, as detailed earlier in the thread. There's also a link to a letter from Historic England outlining their reasons for listing.
 
What would the arguments be therefore in 20 years when it would have to be torn down? Preserving this tower, at great expense for another two decades, is beneficial how?
 
MFP said:
What would the arguments be therefore in 20 years when it would have to be torn down? Preserving this tower, at great expense for another two decades, is beneficial how?
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Again, that's not the point. It's the fact the revocation of listed status happened at lightening speed. Purely to befit the Mayor. Thats the issue here. Blatant government corruption.
 
No, that's your point that you've consistently spewed to deflect from the wider discussion here in this thread. And you're not answering the question, so bore off elsewhere with your tedious quarrels.
 
JackG said:
I think listed status was granted in response to Newy's application, as detailed earlier in the thread. There's also a link to a letter from Historic England outlining their reasons for listing.
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Ahhhh, I hadn't actually realised the application had came from Newyddion.
I only came in to the end of this thread on the morning after it was demolished

So it's a bit earlier than the 10th of September judging from the comments, reading back.

But it also only took 20 minutes to write an application that got it listed, so I'm not surprised that a detailed report on the issues they weren't aware of was able to get it unlisted almost as quickly.
 
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MFP said:
No, that's your point that you've consistently spewed to deflect from the wider discussion here in this thread. And you're not answering the question, so bore off elsewhere with your tedious quarrels.
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Actually no, that is the point of concern. Or at least it should be, if you're against corruption.
 
LaPennaBianca said:
Amazing that in telling me that you don't think your opinion is more important than anyone else's you tell me exactly what I think and why I think it.

I'll deal with the last one - looking back on times we never knew is exactly what groups of people do - it's what ties them together. Whether they're football teams, countries or communities. Wanting to get rid of that, or policing what 'that' should be, is exactly what's atomising our society.
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Talking about the past is. Fine it’s called reminiscing, Any thoughts on my other points.?
It comes down to this, somethings are worth saving, some aren’t, especially at a large financial cost for no outcome.
 
This thread is nearly three weeks old, 19 pages long, closing in on 400 replies and covers a variety of debates and points relating to this tower. You only started screeching about Tory corruption yesterday and the question I asked wasn't addressing you, or your point of concern.
Do you understand this and do you understand this thread is not yours nor is it for you to dictate the conversation?
 
MFP said:
This thread is nearly three weeks old, 19 pages long, closing in on 400 replies and covers a variety of debates and points relating to this tower. You only started screeching about Tory corruption yesterday and the question I asked wasn't addressing you, or your point of concern.
Do you understand this and do you understand this thread is not yours nor is it for you to dictate the conversation?
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Do you understand how conversations evolve?

More importantly do you understand the quote function? It's difficult enough to follow your rants as it is.

So, just to be clear, you are happy with Tory corruption then?
 
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