Raducanu!!!

SilentProf said:
I always felt Andy Murray got a lot of unfair treatment after his throwaway comment about supporting whoever England play at a World Cup. Tyson Fury has been very vocal about considering himself Irish and not British multiple times but gets none
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Otto42 said:
Some real overt racism on these comments.....if you represent a country, that's your country. Interesting documentary about the England players of Caribbean heritage on Sky on Saturday.....Chris Lewis said 'People said I cared less, they want to see me playing against my brothers....I am competitor and never want to lose'
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Back out at seven o clock tonight I think.
 
I personally think AJ divides a lot of people more from association with Eddie Hearn and the path he took becoming pro. People saw him as protected whilst others (like Fury) where fighting on Channel 5 etc.

Lets be honest, its typical Britain to build someone up and then celebrate a fall. We have done it several times and will again - not all negatives towards sportsmen and women is colour related.
 
KDG said:
I personally think AJ divides a lot of people more from association with Eddie Hearn and the path he took becoming pro. People saw him as protected whilst others (like Fury) where fighting on Channel 5 etc.

Lets be honest, its typical Britain to build someone up and then celebrate a fall. We have done it several times and will again - not all negatives towards sportsmen and women is colour related.
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Don't disagree with that....see also Gascoigne, George Best and Botham, it's probably as much to do with our out dated class system as racism?! We haven't got over doffing our caps to the 'gentlemen'!
 
KDG said:
People saw him as protected whilst others (like Fury) where fighting on Channel 5 etc.
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well he certainly wasn't protected with his fight choices, Fury on the other hand.
KDG said:
Lets be honest, its typical Britain to build someone up and then celebrate a fall. We have done it several times and will again - not all negatives towards sportsmen and women is colour related.
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I agree with that, but I'd also add the nuance of the rhetoric of the last 5 years, and how many non whites have faced a vicious backlash to their 'Britishness', however you voted, the B word has enabled and promoted racism and xenophobia. By accident or by design.
 
BoroFur said:
You've hit the nail on the head Marv, she is British.

It's folk arguing that she isn't British who should be the ones to direct your ire at.
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Show me one post that has said she's not British.
You can't because there are none.
 
If Wil
BoroMart said:
Well they both beat Wlad and just 17 months apart. The consensus is that after years at the top, Wlad took his eye off the ball and took Fury for granted. Fury did superb, though. 17 months later Wlad will have lost that complacency, had his hunger back, and he got beat up by a novice AJ. I think those are equal wins.

Now Wilder, great puncher, terrible boxer. He has lost nearly every round he has fought against top 10 fighters. Of which there are only 3. He is a paper champion, whose career defining win was against a 40 year old with a heart defect who had no significant wins on his record. Wilder isn't an 'A class win' because Wilder has nothing of note on his resume.

I agree that outside of Wlad, AJ, Fury, there are no other A class wins on any of their CVs. AJs B and C wins, are way above Fury's C, D and E. Fury doesn't fight top 20 fighters, other than his 3 title fights. AJ doesn't fight outside of the top 15 and hasn't for more than 4 years.

But this discussion just highlights how his record is not looked on through the same eyes as Fury, just like Raducanu is questioned for her integrity as a brit, like Barnes was years ago, like Lennox was. Hamilton should be absolutely loved, like Mansell was, but he isn't because of his vocal stance on racism. I remember Bruno used to get called an uncle Tom because he kept quiet about racism, and instead decided to go along with the elite. It was hard on him, but it was the only we he could be a publicly accepted black athlete at that time.....I wonder how much progress we really have made since then, other than non-white british athletes will now stand up (or kneel down) for their rights.
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BoroMart said:
Well they both beat Wlad and just 17 months apart. The consensus is that after years at the top, Wlad took his eye off the ball and took Fury for granted. Fury did superb, though. 17 months later Wlad will have lost that complacency, had his hunger back, and he got beat up by a novice AJ. I think those are equal wins.

Now Wilder, great puncher, terrible boxer. He has lost nearly every round he has fought against top 10 fighters. Of which there are only 3. He is a paper champion, whose career defining win was against a 40 year old with a heart defect who had no significant wins on his record. Wilder isn't an 'A class win' because Wilder has nothing of note on his resume.

I agree that outside of Wlad, AJ, Fury, there are no other A class wins on any of their CVs. AJs B and C wins, are way above Fury's C, D and E. Fury doesn't fight top 20 fighters, other than his 3 title fights. AJ doesn't fight outside of the top 15 and hasn't for more than 4 years.

But this discussion just highlights how his record is not looked on through the same eyes as Fury, just like Raducanu is questioned for her integrity as a brit, like Barnes was years ago, like Lennox was. Hamilton should be absolutely loved, like Mansell was, but he isn't because of his vocal stance on racism. I remember Bruno used to get called an uncle Tom because he kept quiet about racism, and instead decided to go along with the elite. It was hard on him, but it was the only we he could be a publicly accepted black athlete at that time.....I wonder how much progress we really have made since then, other than non-white british athletes will now stand up (or kneel down) for their rights.
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If Wilder was a paper champ, then AJ isn’t much better.

Pretty much most of his defences were against over the hill fighters like Povetkin and Pulev, or other paper champs like Parker. Then basically C level fighters like Takam, Breazeale etc.

Despite how Eddie Hearn builds it up, AJ’s CV isn’t exactly murderers row when you look at the reality. Some good names but the better ones were way over the hill. The next fight with Usyk is a good one though, real close fight in my opinion. People look at Usyk and Chisora and think Usyk will struggle at heavyweight but AJ isn’t a pressure fighter and swarmer like Chisora. He will give you room to work which might be a real problem against Usyk. Usyk has years of experience with big heavyweights in sparring and also the WSB before he turned pro. So when it comes to the stylistic matchup with AJ, I don’t think size is going to be a huge factor. I think that’s a real fight and massive credit to AJ for taking it and not vacating. I think it’s easily his biggest test since Klitschko, maybe even more so.

Fury has other good wins that get overlooked too, he took Chisora’s 0 and also give him the biggest beating anybody has in the second fight. still the only fight Chisora has never been competitive in. Bearing in mind Chisora is nearly 40 now and still giving younger and good level heavyweights hell, I think retrospectively, they were very good wins, especially handing him his first loss.

Also you can’t say Fury’s win and AJ’s win over Wlad is equal. No fighter gets better at 40 years old with 18 months out of the ring, it doesn’t happen. Fury beat the better and younger version who had dominated the division for 10 years, that’s just fact. If Wlad still had the confidence to finish the job, he would’ve stopped Joshua. Styles make fights anyway, Joshua stylistically was probably a tailor-made appointment for young Klitschko, fairly flat footed who will stand right in front of Klitschko’s jab. So with all his experience, He was always going to be a tough fight for AJ because he made a career fighting a lot of stiff upright fighters like AJ. That’s why he looked good in that fight, despite being older inactive and not the same fighter.
 
We had a boss who was born in Wales, he lived there for less than a month. Known as Taff. He despised it, went wild if heard anyone saying it.

Once a Taff always a Taff.

His own bloody stupidity in mentioning it.
 
BoroFur said:
Well there's one here.
Post in thread 'Raducanu!!!' https://fmttmboro.com/index.php?threads/raducanu.22429/post-512027

And one here.
Post in thread 'Raducanu!!!' https://fmttmboro.com/index.php?threads/raducanu.22429/post-512030

You can argue semantics all you like but you have quite clearly labelled her 'Canadian' when she herself says she is British.
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So you can't and stop lying. I've said she's both.
As I said... get a grip. You are looking for racism when there is none.
Not sure why but cut it out,
 
zzzzz said:
So you can't and stop lying. I've said she's both.
As I said... get a grip. You are looking for racism when there is none.
Not sure why but cut it out,
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I'd withdraw both those accusations if I were you.

I'm not lying because I have linked two of your own posts where you label her Canadian.

And I have not stated or even inferred that you are being racist, that is all in your mind.

Stop digging, withdraw your allegations and apologise.
 
BoroFur said:
I'd withdraw both those accusations if I were you.

I'm not lying because I have linked two of your own posts where you label her Canadian.

And I have not stated or even inferred that you are being racist, that is all in your mind.

Stop digging, withdraw your allegations and apologise.
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No.
I asked you who said she's not British. Nobody has said that.
You said "It's folk arguing that she isn't British who should be the ones to direct your ire at" That is a lie. Nobody on this thread has said that. Thats a direct accusation. Which folk?
I'm not digging for anything just pointing out.

"I'm not lying because I have linked two of your own posts where you label her Canadian." Now THAT is a fact. She is Canadian.
And she's British which I've already said.
Get a grip.
 
HiredGun123 said:
If Wilder was a paper champ, then AJ isn’t much better.

Pretty much most of his defences were against over the hill fighters like Povetkin and Pulev, or other paper champs like Parker. Then basically C level fighters like Takam, Breazeale etc.
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oh don't be silly.

Current rankings AJ has beaten 2, 4, 6, 8, 20 and 21 in the top 25. He has also beaten Wlad, Povetkin, and Molina and Martin who were top 10 at the time they fought.

Wilder has beaten 11 and 21, 25 and that's it, no one in the current top 10, and I'm not sure other than Stiverne any of the others were top 10, and he needed points against him first time.

Fury has beaten Wlad, Wilder, and 14 and 22.

AJ is only 25 fights in, Wilders 26th was against Audrey Harrison, his 30th was against a guy with 16 defeats, Wilder was still fighting bums at the stage that AJ had beaten 4 champs or ex-champs including one of the greats.

It's ludicrous to claim that AJs record isn't miles better than Wilders. You are just providing further evidence how AJs record is not viewed through the same lens as Fury or even Wilder
 
Look Mr Z, just admit your post of "she's Canadian" has got the reaction you wanted as it was intended to be provocative unless of course you point out the nationality of everybody in your posts.

That post could quite easily have said she is both Canadian and British (as you later added) but if you had then we wouldn't be on page 4 of thread that starting out by saying what a good performance by a young British tennis player.
 
BoroMart said:
oh don't be silly.

Current rankings AJ has beaten 2, 4, 6, 8, 20 and 21 in the top 25. He has also beaten Wlad, Povetkin, and Molina and Martin who were top 10 at the time they fought.

Wilder has beaten 11 and 21, 25 and that's it, no one in the current top 10, and I'm not sure other than Stiverne any of the others were top 10, and he needed points against him first time.

Fury has beaten Wlad, Wilder, and 14 and 22.

AJ is only 25 fights in, Wilders 26th was against Audrey Harrison, his 30th was against a guy with 16 defeats, Wilder was still fighting bums at the stage that AJ had beaten 4 champs or ex-champs including one of the greats.

It's ludicrous to claim that AJs record isn't miles better than Wilders. You are just providing further evidence how AJs record is not viewed through the same lens as Fury or even Wilder
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Come on, Molina and Martin were never top 10 heavyweights , who told you that? Eddie Hearn? I could reel off at least 20 heavyweights significantly better than they were at the time.

Martin won a world title via leg injury, he’s never been a top 10 heavyweight. Maybe in the IBF he was, hence his vacant title shot, but the governing body rankings are a joke.

Charles Martin is currently above Usyk, Ruiz, Joyce, Hrgovic in the IBF, you wanna tell me he’s better?

or was it Boxrec, the algorithm that once had Eubank Jr ranked higher P4P than Roman Gonzales after he lost to Sor Rungvisai.

You have to use common sense. There’s never been a time in history when Charles Martin or Eric Molina were in the top 10 heavyweights in the world.

Anyway, I give AJ credit, he has plenty of solid wins. Fury has the better wins in big fights against long reigning champs, but AJ has more consistent solid wins and good defences. I just don’t think AJ’s CV Is quite the murderers row some make it out

Let’s not forget he lost the belts to Ruiz, who really isn’t that good actually, despite the killer they tried to make him out to be after the fight , he’s just decent.
 
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HiredGun123 said:
ou have to use common sense. There’s never been a time in history when Charles Martin or Eric Molina were in the top 10 heavyweights in the world.

Anyway, I give AJ credit, he has plenty of solid wins. Fury has the better wins in big fights against long reigning champs, but AJ has more consistent solid wins and good defences. I just don’t think AJ’s CV Is quite the murderers row some make it out
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Charles Martin certainly, when he was 24 unbeaten with a decent KO record. He wasn't proven, but he was ceratinly borderline top ten at that point.

Furys better wins are the same guy AJ beat, and a paper champ who ducked everyone and fought no one. Wilder can't be classed as a A lister until he beats someone. If he were to retire today his career defining fight would be beating 40 year old, and limited Ortiz....after Ortiz badly rocked him and outboxed him. He has the most padded record since Tyson. Actually it's far worse than Tysons.

HiredGun123 said:
Let’s not forget he lost the belts to Ruiz, who really isn’t that good actually
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He's better than anyone Wilder or Fury have faced bar each other and Wlad. Ruiz would beat Ortiz, and he would beat Wallin. To be honest so would Parker, Pulev, Povetkin, Whyte and maybe even Martin to be honest. Shows how poor Wilder and Fury's opponents have been.
 
HiredGun123 said:
Come on, Molina and Martin were never top 10 heavyweights , who told you that? Eddie Hearn? I could reel off at least 20 heavyweights significantly better than they were at the time.

Martin won a world title via leg injury, he’s never been a top 10 heavyweight. Maybe in the IBF he was, hence his vacant title shot, but the governing body rankings are a joke.

Charles Martin is currently above Usyk, Ruiz, Joyce, Hrgovic in the IBF, you wanna tell me he’s better?

or was it Boxrec, the algorithm that once had Eubank Jr ranked higher P4P than Roman Gonzales after he lost to Sor Rungvisai.

You have to use common sense. There’s never been a time in history we’re Charles Martin or Eric Molina were in the top 10 heavyweights in the world.
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BoroMart said:
Charles Martin certainly, when he was 24 unbeaten with a decent KO record. He wasn't proven, but he was ceratinly borderline top ten at that point.

Furys better wins are the same guy AJ beat, and a paper champ who ducked everyone and fought no one. Wilder can't be classed as a A lister until he beats someone. If he were to retire today his career defining fight would be beating 40 year old, and limited Ortiz....after Ortiz badly rocked him and outboxed him. He has the most padded record since Tyson. Actually it's far worse than Tysons.


He's better than anyone Wilder or Fury have faced bar each other and Wlad. Ruiz would beat Ortiz, and he would beat Wallin. To be honest so would Parker, Pulev, Povetkin, Whyte and maybe even Martin to be honest. Shows how poor Wilder and Fury's opponents have been.
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Ruiz hasn’t beaten anyone except AJ , it’s pure speculation that he could beat fighters you listed

barring that one night v AJ. His biggest achievement was a close loss to Parker and beating a shot to pieces Dimitrenko. Since AJ, he’s fought a 40 year Arreola and got dropped in that fight.

Ruiz has never been any good, that’s why the likes of Top Rank let him go and he was going nowhere with PBC until he got the AJ fight as late replacement.

he’s really not much good, he just got massively overrated from one night. I guarantee he never touches a world title again or beats any consensus top 5 heavyweight in his career.

Hearn and Sky did a hell of a job convincing people he’s a top fighter.
 
Let’s hope at such a young age she can keep it together for a few years at least. Too many of these tennis players fall by the wayside when the money is in the bank.
 
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