Brexit , the negatives

I worked with a returning officer at a polling station - so frankly had a good view of what were the key points in the eyes of the voters in that part of the world. And it was full of ABC1’s.

so you can claim what the hell you like - I am relating to experience on the ground.

Again your tone is exactly that which you accuse others of. No self awareness. Much like on that Britt thread in which you simply couldn’t cope with someone having a different opinion than yours.

I didn’t disagree with your analysis of what the key issue was for leave voters. Plenty of polls confirm it was immigration. Your anecdotal stories about working with a returning officer though doesn’t change the fact that there was plenty of high quality information available and so to tar both sides of the debate with the same brush is wrong. That’s not a claim, it’s a fact.
 
The bottom line is both campaigns regarding Europe were threadbare and offered little for the electorate to consider
It's pretty hard to make 'keep the status quo because it's net benefit' sound better, than 'bloody germans conquering us through the EU, lets get out and we can take back control'. Most people had been through a decade of austerity and were feeling the pinch. The leave campaign claiming indirectly that poor people were struggling because of the EU not austerity was a simple bait and switch move. But it sounded good to those that are easily swayed by rhetoric.
 
The voters in this constituency I would imagine we’re pretty well educated. So the messages were lost on a lot of them. Still I’m done, can’t be arsed to spend a night disagreeing with someone who once more feels he is superior and right to any conflicting opinion.
 
The voters in this constituency I would imagine we’re pretty well educated. So the messages were lost on a lot of them. Still I’m done, can’t be arsed to spend a night disagreeing with someone who once more feels he is superior and right to any conflicting opinion.

Probably best. Before you nip off though, this is the second thread in a week or so in which you’ve told me that you don’t want to spend time disagreeing with someone that thinks he’s right. Just wondering: do you not think you’re right?
 
Adi, why do you revert to being patronising and condescending? Something you claim not to be? You are a strange one.

The bottom line is both campaigns regarding Europe were threadbare and offered little for the electorate to consider. So blame needs to be heaped on those responsible for offering so little to make a considered opinion. The fact is immigration and the money allegedly we could offer the health service were two of the highest motivators for voting no. Shallowness personified.
I disagree that the remain campaign 2016 was threadbare -

Campaigning to remain for economic reasons, jobs and workers rights primarily -

The Conservative Party leadership at the time and most Tory mp’s.
The Labour Party
The Lib Dems
The head of the Bank of England
The CBI
The TUC

Campaigning to be out for immigration, sovereignty, law making primarily, the red bus -

UKIP and the ERG including Johnson and Rees Mogg.
 
I disagree that the remain campaign 2016 was threadbare -

Campaigning to remain for economic reasons, jobs and workers rights primarily -

The Conservative Party leadership at the time and most Tory mp’s.
The Labour Party
The Lib Dems
The head of the Bank of England
The CBI
The TUC


Campaigning to be out for immigration, sovereignty, law making primarily, the red bus -

UKIP and the ERG including Johnson and Rees Mogg.

You can see why people who watched a few clips of the news and read mainly tabloid newspapers would instinctively distrust all of those organisations after years of Tory austerity and incompetence, Lib Dem lies, distrust in the Labour Party over Iraq and the blame put at their door for the financial crisis, the Bank of England, who protected the banking sector in 2008, the CBI representing all the bosses who were creaming in bonuses while keep real earnings for employees down. The TUC has never been allowed to be seen as the voice of the 'reasonable Englishman'.

All of these groups were right of course - leaving the EU is a dead end road, but they had low credibility, and the nativists like UKIP and ERG didn't need credibility, just easy answers.

It still staggers me how much of an easy ride David Cameron gets. He was a Prime Minister of nothingness and his legacy is nothing squared.
 
You can see why people who watched a few clips of the news and read mainly tabloid newspapers would instinctively distrust all of those organisations after years of Tory austerity and incompetence, Lib Dem lies, distrust in the Labour Party over Iraq and the blame put at their door for the financial crisis, the Bank of England, who protected the banking sector in 2008, the CBI representing all the bosses who were creaming in bonuses while keep real earnings for employees down. The TUC has never been allowed to be seen as the voice of the 'reasonable Englishman'.

All of these groups were right of course - leaving the EU is a dead end road, but they had low credibility, and the nativists like UKIP and ERG didn't need credibility, just easy answers.

It still staggers me how much of an easy ride David Cameron gets. He was a Prime Minister of nothingness and his legacy is nothing squared.
I completely agree, there are millions upon millions out there who have no idea who to believe or not believe.

At the same time, that makes the current government very vulnerable themselves because they will not be believed either.
 
I just think that logically flawed. Putting forward an argument that doing something we could have done as a member of the EU is a Brexit benefit because we *might* not have done it makes no sense. In many ways it sums up the argument though that this is a straw that is being clutched. The fact that it is being offered as a benefit speaks volumes I think.
The reason it makes sense to me was because the EU was pressurising it's members not to break ranks. We didn't have that pressure to conform so acted independently.
Entirely logical point of view but I don't expect you to acknowledge that.
 
The reason it makes sense to me was because the EU was pressurising it's members not to break ranks. We didn't have that pressure to conform so acted independently.
Entirely logical point of view but I don't expect you to acknowledge that.
We long had a reputation for not towing the EU line, so that argument really does not wash.
 
The reason it makes sense to me was because the EU was pressurising it's members not to break ranks. We didn't have that pressure to conform so acted independently.
Entirely logical point of view but I don't expect you to acknowledge that.

Because I don’t agree! There is no need for the snark. You say it’s logical to argue that decisions we took whilst effectively still a member of the EU are a benefit of leaving the EU. I say it isn’t.

Moreover I disagree with the entire premise anyway. As a privileged, powerful member of the EU with a history of going our own way and being treated exceptionally it is highly debatable that we would have simply towed the line.

Either way, it is barrel scraping in the extreme to put it forward as a Brexit win.
 
HolgateCorner, you & a few others are excellent posters, you will put your point across without any hint of name calling someone who has the opposite view
I don't mind post after after post about Brexit appearing on here, this forum has threads on every topic imaginable & long may it continue, thats what's good about flyme
What gets me is the constant snipping that goes with it, that's the reason I get involved, the immature way certain posters have to go because what comes back to them they don't agree with

There was a thread about the government been responsible for the recent riots in Bristol due to the bil regarding public protests that we SHOULD have the right for free speech & the right to protest etc & I 100% agree with that, yet on another day, because someone voted how they seen fit & others didn't agree, they are classed as idiots, thick, stupid, racists, bigots etc

Just have debates & talk like adults, this will be my final post on any political thread because you can go on forever, as has been rightly pointed out, just ignore anything regarding Brexit & I will, but carry on, that's what this forum is for

Have a nice day all
I hope it's not your final post Erimus. You and I are on different ends of the Brexit spectrum but your posts have validity just as much as anyone elses and even if I don't agree with what you say I fully respect it and listen to the points you make. Keep on having your tuppence worth-it is what this board is about..
 
I hope it's not your final post Erimus. You and I are on different ends of the Brexit spectrum but your posts have validity just as much as anyone elses and even if I don't agree with what you say I fully respect it and listen to the points you make. Keep on having your tuppence worth-it is what this board is about..
Hi Trug, appreciate that mate, no not the board just politics threads
 
HolgateCorner, you & a few others are excellent posters, you will put your point across without any hint of name calling someone who has the opposite view
I don't mind post after after post about Brexit appearing on here, this forum has threads on every topic imaginable & long may it continue, thats what's good about flyme
What gets me is the constant snipping that goes with it, that's the reason I get involved, the immature way certain posters have to go because what comes back to them they don't agree with

There was a thread about the government been responsible for the recent riots in Bristol due to the bil regarding public protests that we SHOULD have the right for free speech & the right to protest etc & I 100% agree with that, yet on another day, because someone voted how they seen fit & others didn't agree, they are classed as idiots, thick, stupid, racists, bigots etc

Just have debates & talk like adults, this will be my final post on any political thread because you can go on forever, as has been rightly pointed out, just ignore anything regarding Brexit & I will, but carry on, that's what this forum is for

Have a nice day all
Thats become the way on here. The lefty gang just beat up on people. Its what they do. They just want to shout louder. They are wasting their time. The insults that have come from ST to you have been horrendous and playground like. They don't engage with me as I throw more back and they can't cope with it. They just crawl away.
 
This board needs moderators. Its time Rob had some trusty lieutenants to calm things down now and again.
We need a groan button. Those that collect the most each month need to serve a 1 week sin bin suspension
 
Thats become the way on here. The lefty gang just beat up on people. Its what they do. They just want to shout louder. They are wasting their time. The insults that have come from ST to you have been horrendous and playground like. They don't engage with me as I throw more back and they can't cope with it. They just crawl away.

Utter tosh, there are as many villains that are right-leaning as there are from the left and what's more you know it. However, you always want to play the victim and it's gone back to your Clive_Road_Stamper days on the old board and your silly OnTheMap character before it.

You love nothing more than trying to cause trouble, offer nothing to debate and are just a generally unpleasant fella.

This board needs moderators. Its time Rob had some trusty lieutenants to calm things down now and again.
We need a groan button. Those that collect the most each month need to serve a 1 week sin bin suspension

I think if anything other moderators would be likely to ban you and surely there's a huge lack of self-awareness on your part to think you wouldn't get more groans than any other poster on this board.
 
Utter tosh, there are as many villains that are right-leaning as there are from the left and what's more you know it. However, you always want to play the victim and it's gone back to your Clive_Road_Stamper days on the old board and your silly OnTheMap character before it.

You love nothing more than trying to cause trouble, offer nothing to debate and are just a generally unpleasant fella.



I think if anything other moderators would be likely to ban you and surely there's a huge lack of self-awareness on your part to think you wouldn't get more groans than any other poster on this board.
Nailed it
 
Back
Top